An Equine Conversation

LISTENED TO 2 OR MORE EPISODES OF SEASON 6? We would LOVE your feedback. Share your thoughts on S6 of An Equine Conversation here: https://forms.office.com/r/xPrbQcjHPS

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com

S6 E7: Sarah's Story - part 2

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 22 Jul 2025 20:00:00 +0000

Back in S6 E4, I shared the start of my horsie origin story. In this episode, I share more of the memorable moments that helped shape who I am as a horse person and coach today. These memories include: poking poo with a stick, horse’s birthday celebrations, attempting breeding, finding a career path and more.

In this episode we discuss:

(1:29) - introducing today’s episode

(2:12) - poking poo with a stick

(4:06) - the Horse’s Birthday celebrations & my rusty memory

(8:35) - my one and only attempt at breeding

(11:53) - enter Gorden & changing young ambitions

(13:58) - the natural horsemanship explorations

(16:23) - Kallista’s farewell - preparing myself for the future

(18:18) - what to ‘do’ with my life

(22:37) - finding a path (and what wasn’t the path)

(25:42) - Abbey & Tully

(28:54) - moving the horses

(29:42) - episode wrap-up & what’s on next week

Our links mentioned this episode:

Website: Clicker Training Pferde

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com

S6 E6: Blondie's New Life - with Dr Michaela Hempen

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels, Michaela Hempen) — Tue, 15 Jul 2025 20:00:00 +0000

I’m delighted to welcome Dr Michaela Hempen back to An Equine Conversation.

We first met Michaela back in Season 3, Episode 4, where we heard about her Masters research project in crib-biting with a palomino horse call Blondie.

This episode, we’re getting to hear more about the journey that was becoming Blondie’s owner which took Blondie from a life in a small space and not being allowed to have much of a voice, to a horse living out 24/7, whose voice is heard, and we explore some of what happened during that transition.

Dr Michaela Hempen:

Dr Michaela Hempen has graduated in Veterinary Medicine with a PhD in Veterinary Public Health. She works at the European Food Safety Authority as a Scientific Officer in the area of biological hazards (bacteria, viruses, parasites) and animal welfare.

She also has a Masters's degree in Equine Science. Her thesis was supervised by Dr Jesus Rosales Ruiz from North Texas University, that we’ll be discussing today.

Michaela has been addicted to horses since early childhood. Her first horse Asfaloth is still with her and has since been joined by Graya and Blondie. Michaela’s training with horses has been most strongly influenced by:

Horse trainer, author and podcaster Alexandra Kurland of The Clicker Centre,
Anja Beran, head of the internationally renowned ‘Gut Rosenhof’ training centre in Germany who uses classical dressage as physiotherapy for horses, and
the Feldenkrais method which has been integral to the improvement of Michaela’s riding and interaction with horses.

Michaela has been involved in organising, hosting and presenting at various clinics and workshops for and with Alexandra Kurland & also involving Dr Jesús Rosales-Ruiz, and Mary Hunter. In 2021 Michaela co-presented with Alexandra at Clicker Expo Live, and the year after, both Michaela and Alexandra hosted an online workshop that combined dressage and clicker training with Anja Beran as a special guest.

Also, in 2022, Michaela taught students of a German certification programme for horse-assisted interventions.

Michaela offers personalised online coaching for horse owners, which is based on learning from Alexandra Kurland & Anja Beran. You can find more information on Michaela’s Clicker Training Pferde website, Facebook page, YouTube and Instagram – links we will share with you in the show notes together with her science-related profiles for those interested.

In this episode we discuss:

(1:29) - episode & guest introduction

(4:59) - welcome & where in the world: climate & landscape

(7:41) - the wildlife

(9:51) - heat & the horses lifestyle

(11:04) - hay & managing a herd with diverse needs

(14:29) - individualised feeding

(16:08) - automated systems gaining popularity in Germany

(21:36) - Blondie’s cribbing: an update

(24:59) - an update on the cribbing research write-up: bringing 2 different philosophies on behaviour together

(31:18) - we need both philosophies as equine caregivers: a holistic approach

(33:31) - we need to test assumptions

(37.38) - on the challenges in the competition world

(40:16) - training challenges & adventures with Blondie after her very different life before & no handling until owning her

(43:54) - the 1st surprise

(45:07) - the next challenge & how it was overcome

(48:53) - dealing with the peer pressure/social situation

(56:37) - the delay in moving Blondie

(58:55) - ‘no’ to saddling & a training plan to get to a ‘yes’

(1:11:11) - top tips for you

(1:17:22) - where can you find out more about learning with Michaela & Blondie’s journey

(1:23:51) - episode wrap-up & what’s on next week

Links from Michaela:

Facebook: Clicker Training Pferde

Instagram: Clicker Training Pferde

YouTube channel

ResearchGate

Dr Jesus Rosales Ruiz & Mary Hunter: Behavior Explorer

‘Tactics of Scientific Research Evaluating Experimental Data in Psychology’ - Murray Sidman

Our links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com

S6 E5: How a Table-top Game can make you a better Owner/Trainer - with Mary Hunter

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels, Mary Hunter) — Tue, 8 Jul 2025 20:00:00 +0000

To the uninitiated, suggesting that a table-top game can make us be better horse trainers may sound a bit bonkers. But to those of us in the know, and those of us who have played this and similar games, we have experienced just what a positive difference they can make to our training in what is a low-risk environment – there’s no chance of us stuffing up our horses.

I’m so pleased to have Mary Hunter from Behavior Explorer join me today to explain a little about how this works and why playing a game, away from our horses can do so much for us.

Plus, we get to hear Mary’s horsie origin story too, where, much like Lucy in S6 E3, Mary had a particular, special horse who really changed the trajectory of her life.

Mary Hunter:

Mary Hunter earned an undergraduate degree in biology from the University of Chicago and a master’s degree in behavior analysis from the University of North Texas. Mary’s business, Behavior Explorer (BehaviorExplorer.com), offers educational courses and programs for individuals interested in the science of behavior. In addition, she teaches as an adjunct instructor in the behavior analysis department at the University of North Texas. In 2019, Mary and Dr. Jesús Rosales-Ruiz published their first book, PORTL: The Portable Operant Research and Teaching Lab.

Mary’s research interests include studying the process of shaping and finding better ways to teach people to train animals. Her master’s thesis, which examined the effects of a single reinforcer during shaping, was published in 2019 in the Journal of the Experimental Analysis of Behavior. She is a full member of the Association for Behavior Analysis International and has presented her research at the organization’s annual convention.

In her free time, Mary has lots of fun training her young filly, Chewie. She also blogs about her horse training adventures on her personal blog, StaleCheerios.com.

In this episode we discuss:

(1:30) - introducing to today’s episode & guest

(4:07) - where in the world

(8:57) - horses: where it all began

(10:41) - enter Casey Jane (CJ)

(14:02) - needing to figure out a different way & a transformation

(16:24) - going back to Graduate School to learn more

(16:50) - how a single, challenging horse can change the trajectory of life

(18:35) - the direction of study leading to the field of Behaviour Analysis

(22:43) - getting to learn hands-on with rescue horses

(24:29) - consulting and enter Apollo

(26:39) - taking up Horse Agility

(31:24) - analysing our own behaviour & why we make certain decisions & our own motivations

(37:55) - farewell Apollo & welcome Chewie

(43:37) - teaching humans in various places

(47:07) - PORTL: how a table-top game makes us better horse trainers

(51:14) - the difficulty of practicing these skills with our animals

(53:41) - practicing non-verbally, getting creative with the environment & breaking things down into bite-size pieces

(1:01:12) - practicing being able to adjust what we’re doing based on what our horse is doing

(1:07:06) - the role of previous learning

(1:14:14) - helping develop empathy for ourselves & our learners

(1:18:05) - reducing frustration for safety

(1:21:38) - honing our timing

(1:24:27) - opportunities to play with us & where to get PORTL

(1:26:54) - tips for you

(1:34:10) - where to find out and learn more

(1:36:07) - episode wrap-up & what’s on next week

Links from Mary:

Behavior Explorer: BehaviorExplorer.com

Personal blog: StaleCheerios.com

Our links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com

S6 E4: Sarah's Story - part 1

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 1 Jul 2025 20:00:00 +0000

Throughout An Equine Conversation, we capture many of our guests horsie origin stories… but of course, being the interviewer, I’m the one asking the questions. In this episode, I’m going to share with you the early years of my own horsie origin story & some of the strong memories I have along the way.

If you like a story, this episode is for you.

In this episode we discuss:

(1:28) - introducing today’s episode

(2:01) - where it all began & hypothesis on why it all began

(6:16) - when & where the learning started

(7:08) - riding school #1 - Sherbrook

(9:36) - riding school #2 - the adventures at MBRS

(22:17) - enter Abbey, who our business & property is named for

(26:32) - the start of my coaching & instructing career

(29:42) - horse-themed books

(30:58) - the special experiences at MBRS

(35:19) - colleagues, students & teaching

(37:44) - episode wrap-up & what’s on next week

Our links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com

S6 E3: Lucy & Tao's story - with Lucy Chester

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Lucy Chester, Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 24 Jun 2025 20:00:00 +0000

I so much enjoyed recording this conversation with Lucy Chester from Lucy Chester Horsemanship in England. I’ve followed Lucy’s work for a while and admired her care of her horse Tao, and the work she has been doing to raise the profile of more ethical training approaches. I wanted to hear Lucy’s horsie origin story and to hear about Tao’s story too, as I knew it had not been and still isn’t all smooth sailing. Lucy's story is, I think, very inspiring.

It was amazing to finally connect with Lucy and to realise just how much of the learning journey that we had both experienced, despite being on opposite sides of the world.

Lucy Chester:

Lucy is a fully insured clicker-trainer based in the South East of England. She won ‘Behavioural Trainer of the Year’ in 2023 and does clinics and demos around the UK as well as abroad. She completed a LANTRA certified horse behaviour course and continues to study alongside teaching full-time. Lucy enjoys helping owners to understand and help their horses through the application of behavioural science and to strengthen their relationships by using positive reinforcement.

Lucy’s photograph by Ellie Osborne Photography

In this episode we discuss:

(1:29) - introducing today’s episode & guest

(3:25) - where in the world

(6:35) - Lucy’s horsie origin story - the slippery slope of that 1st pony ride

(7:55) - the start of the pony shares, liberty work & trick training

(9:47) - welcome Tao, illness & making life choices

(11:57) - working in film

(16:08) - priorities: the challenge of balancing work & wanting to be a hands-on owner

(18:57) - Tao, changing the course of life

(20:31) - finding Tao

(25:20) - Tao’s arrival & the early days: the dream becomes a nightmare

(30:42) - relating to Tao’s story with Fernando & the life-changing they incite

(34:38) - it was never his fault - getting the Vet involved

(37:56) - the impact of the environment on behaviour

(39:12) - the physiological things

(40:43) - a multi-faceted approach & needing to advocate

(49:38) - Tao’s equine physical support & working as part of an equine care team

(52:19) - it’s hard to believe the history seeing Tao today & the glorification of the extreme behaviour online

(55:32) - looking for the root causes: resolving physical & management issues can stop unwanted behaviour

(1:00:00) - context matters & the importance of being able to ‘horse’

(1:03.56) - finding positive reinforcement & the importance of having a horse free to say ‘no’

(1:09.19) - the conflict

(1:12.01) - let’s talk about ‘liberty’

(1:17.44) - what we see as ‘liberty’ isn’t necessarily ‘liberty’ & the need to sense-check what we’re looking at & assessing the horse’s emotion & comfort

(1:22:03) - the impact of equestrian art & it’s subliminal messaging

(1:25:07) - highlights from the last year of educating humans

(1:30:41) - who inspires Lucy

(1:33:06) - Lucy’s top tips for you

(1:39:53) - episode wrap-up & what’s on next week

Links from Lucy:

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/lucychesterhorsemanship/

Instagram: @haflingeratliberty / @lucychesterhorsemanship

Our links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com

S6 E2: Yes, but...

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 17 Jun 2025 20:00:00 +0000

In today’s episode, I’m going to chat about my training approach. Why it’s not just about positive reinforcement training.

Late last year, I was asked some great questions about my training approach that really got me thinking. And as this has become clearer to me, well, nothing’s changed, it’s more I’ve found the words to explain it, I want to share those words with you.

I should say, in a later episode this Season, I’m going to speak about my horsie origin story, so we’re not going into that detail here. This is about where I’m at in my story just now.

So, do I train with positive reinforcement, abbreviated as a capital R followed immediately with a plus sign? My answer to that is: yes, BUT.

And there are really 3 ‘buts’ here that I’ll talk through this episode.

Image thanks to Rachel Flynn Equine Photography

In this episode we discuss:

(1:30) - introducing today’s episode

(2:54) - the first ‘but’

(8:57) - the second ‘but’

(11:46) - the third ‘but’

(26:11) - episode wrap-up & what’s on next week

Our links mentioned this episode:

Bunjilaka Aboriginal Cultural Centre at Melbourne Musuem

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com

S6 E1: Acknowledging Country - with Terori Hareko-Avaivilla

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Terori Hareko-Avaivilla, Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 10 Jun 2025 20:00:00 +0000

We are so excited to be back with Season 6 of An Equine Conversation. This episode, to start off Season 6, is a little different. I’m straying, on purpose, from the particularly equine-focused discussion, to instead share a conversation with you on something that is really important to us here at Abbey’s Run Equestrian. I’ve invited my beautiful friend, Terori Hareko-Avaivilla along for a conversation about Acknowledging Country, which is what you hear me do at the very start of every episode.

We’re also going to yarn about Terori’s passion for wellness and the space she is holding for women to heal and be well. Annnd we end up down a few other important rabbit holes as well.

I met Terori through my past day-job, when I attended her Working in Two Worlds cultural awareness training after a colleague recommended the training to me. I then went on to champion this training and something like another 80 past colleagues have since attended, and, the gorgeous Terori and I have become friends. I love Terori’s training so much, it’s incredibly powerful, as is her passion for for wellness – something many of us could do with a hefty dose of.

I have been lucky enough to work for a couple of years in my past day-job, as an ally in the First Peoples Self-determination space. This has been some of the most important and most profound work I’ve had the pleasure of contributing to. It’s some of the work I’m the most proud of. It’s an incredibly important space here, a surprisingly fast-moving space.

Part of my work was helping other non-First Peoples folks to increase their own First Peoples cultural awareness to create spaces and work together in ways that are culturally safe for our First People’s colleagues and friends. What I observed from everyone I supported in this space, was the absolute desire to do the right thing, but with some confusion and some worry over what the right thing is, which was leading people to inaction. I think this is true of many of us.

So, I wanted to create this episode to help you, lovely listener, along on your own unique journey of cultural awareness. While this episode is Australian, and somewhat Victorian focused, there are learnings in this for many of us in our different corners of the world. As I said earlier, this is something we feel really passionate about here at Abbey’s Run Equestrian. Acknowledging and honouring the First People’s of this Country. I mean, how amazing it is to live here, where the oldest, continuous living culture on earth exists. It’s mind-blowing really. We are very privileged to be custodians of the land we know as Abbey’s Run just now and Acknowledge the care shown to this Country by those who came before. So, while we want to keep going on our own cultural awareness and cultural safety journey, we want to help support you too, with, as usual, some quality information that we hope helps inspire you to learn more.

NAIDOC Week

In this podcast episode, we make mention of NAIDOC Week several times. 2025 marks the 50 years of honouring and elevating indigenous voices, culture and resilience. NAIDOC Week is a National week of celebration held across Australia in the first week of July each year. The week is to celebrate and recognise the history, culture and achievements of Aboriginal & Torres Strait Islander peoples. It’s an opportunity for us all to learn. There are lots of events on around the Country, and usually relevant TV programming, particularly on ABC and SBS, and with book shops elevating titles written by First People’s authors. You can find out more about NAIDOC week by visiting naidoc.org.au – I’ll include a link in the show notes.

ANZAC Day

I want to note at the front end of this episode that we recorded this 2 days after ANZAC Day. ANZAC Day, on the 25th of April, is a national day of remembrance that commemorates those who have served Australia in times of peace and war. Unfortunately at the dawn service held in Melbourne, a small handful of individuals acted like jerks. They were overtly racist to First Peoples, disturbing the entire ceremony, disrespecting everyone. This behaviour is abhorrent. It is not okay that we behave like that towards others. Kindness costs nothing. Be kind.

Terori Hareko-Avaivilla:

Managing Director, Avaivilla Group. First Nation Cultural Educator, Wellness wisdom holder (Water and Koko ceremony), Artist and Storyteller.

Terori is a passionate cultural educator, artist, storyteller and wisdom holder of water and koko ceremony. She is the founder of Avaivilla Group, a First Nations business based in Narrm (Melbourne). Avaivilla Group provides the ‘Working in Two Worlds’ Cultural Education program, giving allies the cultural space to unpack and have a conversation about First Nations ways of knowing, doing and being. Avaivilla Group’s other arm of the business is Cultural Wellness, the ‘Ngarra-Djarra Gurri Bunmarra’ (meaning ‘Heal, Well Health’ in the Woi-wurrung language of the Wurundjeri Nation), is a wellness program focused on women’s healing journeys. It offers a cultural space for women of all cultures and beliefs to gather, to share cultural knowledge and ceremony. Nurturing First Nations understanding and practices of healing and wellness.

‘FLOAT’ is Avaivilla Groups destination wellness retreat for women 35 years and over. The focus of the wellness retreat is to nurture and ground women in traditional wellness practices, with Vanuatu as the background to offer a unique experience.

Much of the work Terori does focus on traditional water practices of healing, grounding and energy movement.

‘Healing is a personal journey for individuals, as a traditional facilitator of wellness and healing, I have the privilege to journey with women for some of their journey. And it is always so fulfilling when our paths cross, you feel the energy and you know that there is a story, a journey and the embracing of wholeness'.

Photo credit: Sally of Nicebola Photography in Port Vila Vanuatu

*FLOAT25 early bird registration is open now until end of July 2025. Women can find out more about our retreat via our website: www.avaivillagroup.com.au/wellnessevents

In this episode we discuss:

(1:26) - introducing today’s episode & guest

(7:36) - a note on ANZAC Day

(8:33) - welcome Terori & where in the world

(11:51) - coffee & rice cookers

(15:34) - connections to salt water

(17:15) - and fresh water too

(24:21) - cultural sharing & learning: general info & cultural protocols

(32:30) - Terori’s horsie connections

(35:34) - Acknowledging Country

(38:40) - why, when & how

(42:43) - authenticity & ‘lore’ versus ‘law’

(45:32) - Acknowledging whose Country you’re on & how to find out

(55:33) - increasing information available to us: conversations & curiosity

(1:01:36) - NAIDOC Week

(1:03:03) - approach cultural educators & appropriate organisations - not just anyone & get along to public events

(1:07:59) - The difference between an Acknowledgement of Country and a Welcome to Country

(1:10:52) - smoking ceremonies

(1:14:33) - proactive learning

(1:24:44) - tips for being a good ally

(1:28:35) - talking wellness

(1:41:58) - where to find out more

(1:44:05) - support First Nations businesses

(1:47:27) - we all need glasses to read the menu & connecting to maintain

(1:51:15) - a shorter wellness opportunity

(1:52:23) - the impact of racism & the importance of allies

(2:04:09) - episode wrap-up & what’s on next week

Link from Terori:

Main website: www.avaivillagroup.com.au

FLOAT wellness retreats: www.avaivillagroup.com.au/wellnessevents

Facebook: www.facebook.com/AvaivillaGroup/

Instagram: www.instagram.com/avaivilla_group/

NAIDOC Week website

Our Links mentioned this episode:

Please share with us, your thoughts on S5 of An Equine Conversation

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com

S6: Trailer

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 3 Jun 2025 20:00:00 +0000

Hello there lovely listener,

I'm Sarah Nickels, your host, and I am delighted let you know that Season 6 of An Equine Conversation starts next Wednesday. As always, Season 5 includes 8 episodes, released weekly on a Wednesday morning (Melbourne time, GMT+10).

Be sure to subscribe so you never miss an episode & please tell everyone about An Equine Conversation so that we can get more great information to more lovely people.

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production and consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com.

S5 E8: The path to mules - with Ellen Cochrane

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels, Ellen Cochrane) — Tue, 24 Dec 2024 19:00:00 +0000

I’m delighted to welcome Ellen Cochrane back to An Equine Conversation. We heard from Ellen in Season 4, talking all about equine agility and The International Horse Agility Club. This episode is something quiet different: We’re hearing about Ellen’s journey to and experiences in working with mules, both her own mule Inara, and her voluntary efforts in supporting humans working with mules in Morocco to improve welfare outcomes for animals and people. I get tingles even thinking about this episode & what Ellen has been involved with. I hope you find the episode as educational and inspiring as I have.

Ellen Cochrane:

Ellen Cochrane is from Worcestershire, England. She is a positive reinforcement trainer who works with a variety of equines and their humans through her business Gaia Horsemanship and as part of her work with the International Horse Agility Club - listen to Season 4, Episode . Ellen works mostly with horses in England but she has a huge passion for mules which started in 2014 when she started working to improve mule welfare in Morocco. Ellen works in the High Atlas Mountains of Morocco helping muleteers to improve the welfare of their working mules by improving knowledge and communication and using kinder equipment, plus Ellen is the UK ambassador for Moroccan-based equine rescue charity, Jarjeer Donkey and Mule refuge. Ellen has her own mule, Inara, who has gone from unhandled and fearful of humans to Horse Agility World Champion.

In this episode we discuss:

1:26 - Merry Christmas!

3:10 - introduction to today’s episode & guest

7:26 - Ellen’s horsie origin story

10:20 - how positive reinforcement came into Ellen’s world

12:20 - Ellen’s herd

18:09 - conditions & context

22:15 - what’s haylage?

25:04 - how Ellen got involved with mules - a request to go to Morocco

27:46 - the work done by the mules in the mountains of Morocco

30:18 - where the work with mules & humans began

32:33 - what even is a mule & mule breeding

36:41 - what happened after the first trip, working alongside muleteers

42:00 - how does the communication happen: language & gender roles

45:28 - engaging effectively with the male muleteers as an English woman

46:59 - the primary things Ellen helps muleteers with

52:54 - being sought out & the muleteers ‘paying it forward’, a story showing how amazing mules are

55:26 - mule social needs

56:28 - the amazing work of the Jarjeer Mule and Donkey Trust

1:00:36 - trips to Morocco now & contrasts

1:02:32 - getting a mule back at home

1:09:26 - going back to Morocco

1:12:42 - tips for working with mules

1:16:47 - finding out more & supporting

1:19:35 - huge thanks to Ellen for all her efforts

1:23:24 - wrapping up this episode & Season 5 of An Equine Conversation

Links from Ellen:

Gaia Horsemanship Website: www.gaiahorsemanship.co.uk

Gaia Horsemanship Facebook: www.facebook.com/gaiahorsemanship

It’s A Mule’s Life Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/itsamuleslife

Jarjeer Donkey and Mule refuge Website: https://www.jarjeer.org/

Jarjeer Donkey and Mule refuge Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/jarjeermules

Our links mentioned this episode:

Equine Dental Clinic Ltd on Facebook

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com

S5 E7: My Accident

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 17 Dec 2024 19:00:00 +0000

On the 8th of June 2008, my life changed forever with a split-second accident that saw me trampled by my then 2.5-year-old horse, Fernando, and air-lifted to Hospital for life-saving surgery.

This episode is the story of that accident, what happened, the damage that did and where that’s left me now.

Before I even introduce this episode, I want to give you a warning. This episode talks about my accident in some detail. There has been one person who on hearing the story, when I was still in Hospital, passed out as a result. If you are someone likely to do that, then please skip this episode or at least, do not listen while driving or doing something where you could get injured… I don’t want my accident resulting in other accidents… not the effect I’m hoping for!

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In S4 E4 of An Equine Conversation, Why Virtual Learning’s Worth Exploring, I make mention of my being immune-compromised and why for me, that’s one of the reasons that virtual learning is so awesome as I’m so limited to what’s possible in-person due to the very real and serious threat Covid still holds for me. I mention this again in S4 E5 with Erin Moore too when we’re talking about giving micro & small business owners a metaphorical hug – I like a good hug personally but being immune compromised makes it a no-no.

So anyway, in this episode of An Equine Conversation I’m going to share with you my story of the horsey accident that left me immune-compromised. It’s a story I’ve told many times. I know some of you will have heard some or all of it before. For those newer to me and my work teaching and my approach, hearing about this part of my story will help inform you more about who I am, what I’m about and why I’m passionate about safety… and importantly, why my horse Fernando and I have a very unique, very special relationship and why he has been my best teacher.

In this episode we discuss:

1:22 - episode warning

2:04 - episode introduction

3:29 - the 8th of June 2008

5:09 - the backstory of Fernando’s misadventures, to get you up to speed

9:18 - setting the scene & it all going pear-shaped

13:19 - paramedics ahoy!

16:17 - arriving at The Alfred (Hospital)

21:02 - time in Hospital isn’t fun but it was busy

28:21 - recovering at home & an unexpected Hospital re-visit scenario

38:43 - the upshot of my injuries now

48:02 - how I’ve changed my outlook (or not) as a result of the accident

53:57 - Fernando, the best teacher

57:38 - take-aways from my experience

1:01:33 - episode wrap-up & what’s on next week

Links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com

S5 E6: The Horse's Mouth - with Dr Paul Owens

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels, Dr Paul Owens) — Tue, 10 Dec 2024 19:00:00 +0000

I am so pleased to be welcoming our 2nd first time guest to An Equine Conversation for Season 5. We’ve had some super wild weather here in my part of the world this Spring that meant this guest and I had to reschedule recording this episode multiple times. Despite the severe storms, power-outages, trees down, no internet, we got there in the end and are bringing you an episode with our most wonderful Equine Veterinary Dentist, Dr Paul Owens from the Horse Vet Dentist.

I won’t lie, I used to think the horses mouth was a whole lot simpler than it is. For many years, my horses had an annual visit from an equine dental technician. I’d seen a couple of talks given by them & I thought I knew much of what there was to know. Gosh, how wrong I was! It was thanks to a number of wonderful horsie friends whose opinions I rate, who were working with Dr Paul Owens and singing his praises, that we too got Paul on board our horse-care team maybe 4-5 years ago now. And wow, have we learnt so much over that time. Paul’s knowledge is amazing, as is his preparedness to educate interested owners. Each time Paul’s here, which is every 6-months, there are things I learn and get to see with my own eyes in my horses mouths which is really impactful for my understanding.

We really love having Paul as part of our herd’s care team as we share the mission of improving welfare for equines through our work and both love learning more, with Paul bringing us information on the latest research into all things horses mouths. Not only that, but we get to hear some cool stories about the work he does with Zoo’s Victoria too. Which, for those of you who like me, train with positive reinforcement, mean that Paul is already really familiar with this training approach as he sees it in action in his work with the Zoo & is so awesome in supporting what I do with my herd, which can be to our amusement. In his visit here just a few weeks ago, Rufus is such a pro at loading on the crush, we’ve made it so positively reinforcing for him, that he took himself there before we were even ready for him.

In today’s episode, we’re going to peer inside the horse’s mouth with Paul and learn a bunch about how it works and equine oral health care.

Dr Paul Owens:

Paul graduated from the University of Liverpool in the UK in 2001 following a degree in Animal Science and PhD in Animal Nutrition. He worked in North Yorkshire in mixed practice where he developed his interest in equine dentistry attending several BEVA course in this field.

In 2007 Paul came to Australia working in Equine/Small Animal Practice in SE Melbourne before eventually setting up a dedicated veterinary dentistry practice in 2011 called HorseVetDentist.

The practice offers a wide range of equine dentistry services from routine dental assessments to referrals for advanced dental extraction techniques, periodontal treatments and restorative dentistry.

Paul is a tutor on the EVDS veterinary dentistry courses and teaches veterinary students at the U-Vet centre Werribee. He has been fortunate to assist with dentistry procedures at Zoos Victoria and Healesville Sanctuary.

Paull attained his MANCVS Memberships in Equine Dentistry in 2014 and continues to attend workshops in dentistry both overseas and in Australia.

In this episode we discuss:

1:23 - introduction to this episode & to Dr Paul Owens

4:08 - Dr Paul Owens bio

5:20 - welcoming Paul

6:59 - Paul’s Vet Dentist origin story & ongoing education

13:24 - the importance of evidence-based practice

15:37 - how the horse’s mouth works

20:33 - are donkey and mule mouths the same?

21:24 - what a horses’s oral check/assessment involves (a lot!)

30:53 - teeth are living structures

33:14 - the carrot bite test & the periodontal ligament

35:22 - dental pain in humans and horses (with a shout-out to Dr Chris Pearce at the Equine Dental Clinic Ltd)

40:00 - size of the carrot for the carrot bite test

42:16 - 2 big common dental diseases of the front teeth: nerve exposure & EOTRH

46:03 - more on dental (and other) pain in horses & how easy it is to miss (shout-out to Dr Sue Dyson)

51:05 - one thorough oral examination is not enough - it’s a repeated process as our horses’ mouths are dynamic & change over time

54:23 - standards for thorough oral examination timelines

57:01 - horses’ baby teeth

1:03:02 - top tips for dental health

1:11:55 - on working with Zoo’s Victoria animals

1:17:09 - episode wrap-up & what’s on next week

Links from Paul:

The HorseVetDentist on Facebook

Our links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com

S5 E5: Conscious Consumerism: how not to tank the market - with Erin Moore

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels, Erin Moore) — Tue, 3 Dec 2024 19:00:00 +0000

Please note: this episode does contain 'conversational profanity'

I am so grateful for the knowledge that business coach, Erin Moore has brought into my life & so I’m delighted that Erin is back with me on An Equine Conversation this episode, to share more of her wisdom with you.

In this episode, we’re taking a look at some of the gnarly problems that face micro & small businesses, especially those who work in caring industries (with a focus on the equine world). We consider some of the differences between big and small businesses, and how our consumer expectations differ between the two.

We discuss how you, we, as consumers, can support micro & small businesses so that they/we, can continue to provide awesome products and services to you, …. and not contribute to ‘tanking the market’. Annnnd there might be some great tips in there for micro & small business owners too.

There is so much in this episode that it’s hard to capture it all in a short, written intro, so you’ll just have to listen to hear all the wisdom within.

Erin Moore:

Erin Moore was a dog trainer for 13 years, and, by her own admission, made every mistake a dog training business owner could make. After burning out and leaving the industry completely, Erin knew that if she wanted to come back to it, she would need to figure out a different way to do things. So Erin did just that. She hired a coach and learned all about the business end of things, and that changed her entire business and her life. Now Erin coaches trainers on how to set up their businesses so that they can actually have a life and not burn out like she did!

In this episode we discuss:

1:24 - profanity warning

1:52 - introduction to this episode & giving the context (shout-out to Jemima from the now closed Sweet Iron Co & Shelby from Milestone Equestrian)

8:23 - welcome back Erin

9:24 - the caring industry, small versus big businesses

13:31 - defining ‘tanking the market’

15:38 - I’ve done it & the absence of business education

19:00 - being draw to a caring industry, our values & beliefs & how we can help more people

21:11 - free content - time & effort and small versus big business

24:41 - the impact on veterinarians

32:07 - the extra load of financial stress & empathising with the humans

35:33 - if we’re not financially secure, we can’t help anyone and regardless, we can’t help everyone

37:41 - when small businesses make more money, they can help more people

40:07 - the impact of not supporting small business

42:01 - a snapshot of the different hats worn in a business & the costs you don’t see

49:37 - the different aspects of running a micro or small business - besides the actual passion part

52:22 - the correlation between neurodivergence & small business

53:11 - where does the time go in business

54:40 - the importance of self-care for how we show up in business (or what you get as a consumer)

1:00:45 - what do we do as consumers - what’s your sphere of influence (shout-out to Samantha from The School of Visibility)

1:09:37 - more top tips on what you can do & a summary of what you can do

1:17:20 - episode wrap-up & what’s on next week

Links from Erin:

Free, thought-provoking resources on Erin’s website (and other ways to work with Erin too)

Find Erin on Facebook at https://www.facebook.com/businessendoftheleash

Our links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com

S5 E4: Why Virtual Learning's Worth Exploring

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 26 Nov 2024 20:00:00 +0000

In today’s episode I’m going to chat with you about the awesomeness of virtual learning in the horse world. This episode is inspired in part by Ivy sharing her experience in last week’s episode and just how integral Michelle’s remote support has been to Swagger and Ivy’s journey and progress. But it’s also inspired by my own experiences with the virtual learning landscape, and by conversations I’ve had with a few people who groan at the prospect…

And if, you’ve had to do eLearns for your job, then um, let me just say that these can be, uh, dry, and um, uninspiring. So please, please don’t rate your virtual learning experience based on those alone!

If you are groaning at me suggesting more screen time, I know so many people have screen-fatigue, particularly off the back of Covid and due to the way some jobs now operate, I’m not immune from this at all, but if you can stand to, bear with me while I talk through why virtual or remote learning is awesome and why it’s not actually always about the screen. Spoiler alert, you’re listening to me right now, learning, sans screen.

I want to nudge you up-front to say that you’re actually likely already engaging in enjoyable, helpful, virtual learning - most likely the free stuff if not paid. Like me, you’re a good chance to have watched things on YouTube, see things on social media, read blog posts, and I mean, you’re listening to this podcast. You’re doing it already!

Today, I’m talking more about the paid virtual learning opportunities that exist. I’m going to start with talking about my experience as a learner, then expand on what online learning can do for you. Then I’m going to switch and talk about my experience as an educator and coach and what it’s like from that perspective – which will also explore why the benefits for me and other coaches are benefits for you too.

In this episode we discuss:

1:24 - episode introduction

3:00 - you’re already doing it

4:01 - my experiences as a learner with remote/virtual learning

5:13 - the challenge of being so far away

7:28 - the variety of online learning delivery methods

8:47 - horses get to stay home

9:58 - loving virtual learning despite technology not being ‘my first language’

10:49 - making new friends

12:54 - it’s inclusive for me

14:22 - benefits of remote/virtual learning for you & some of the challenges with a conventional format

18:28 - it’s not always about the screen

22:06 - consuming on your time, in your location

23:44 - learning remotely is not new here in Australia

25:04 - learning the tech is like learning anything

26:18 - why virtual learning is great as an educator with a micro-business & why that makes it great for you too, starting with some of my history to give context

31:27 - the overheads, the real costs

33:15 - what virtual learning offers us

36:02 - in-person learning is also awesome

36:56 - ask super nicely

38:29 - after listening

40:14 - episode wrap-up & what’s on next week

Links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com

S5 E3: Swagger's journey - with Ivy Starnes

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels, Ivy Starnes) — Tue, 19 Nov 2024 19:00:00 +0000

Today we welcome our first new guest for this Season. Ivy Starnes caught my attention through her generous sharing of videos documenting her journey with a horse called Swagger, a young, now gelding who was previously living in the wild. I’ve been captivated by Ivy’s training with the support of her coach and friend Michelle, as they help this incredibly unique and quite spectacular horse learn about connecting with humans. He has forced Ivy to really refine her training, and it is super inspiring to watch.

Not only is the training lovely, and the problem-solving Ivy and Michelle work through, but also Ivy’s dedication to recording the journey and then paying forward the assistance she was given earlier in life, by sharing the footage so openly.

I’m so pleased that Ivy is joining me today so we (I mean, let’s be honest, I invite people onto An Equine Conversation so I get to hear from them too) get to hear more detail around Ivy’s experience with this seriously unique horse.

Ivy Starnes:

Ivy Starnes has been training horses since she was 16 years old. She started with natural horsemanship methods and has slowly moved more and more towards positive reinforcement. While she still uses pressure and release, Ivy is doing more and more with clicker training. She spends most of her training and teaching working with gaited horses and riders, working to get a smooth and relaxed gait for the trail.

In April of 2023, Ivy was given McSwagger to train for the Heart of Phoenix Equine Rescue. Swagger was a feral gelding from eastern Kentucky and Ivy had no previous experience training wild horses. Ivy had seen wild mustangs trained before and assumed she would be able to train Swagger just as easily. He quickly proved her wrong and Ivy is on a journey of training Swagger using only positive reinforcement, documenting the moments and sharing them so others will realize that some horses really do need a lot of time to overcome their fear.

In this episode we discuss:

1:25 - episode introduction

3:50 - where in the world are Ivy & Swagger & the climate they live and train in

11:55 - talking hay

12:42 - whoops, sorry Tassie listeners! The rest of what I said was right but you are not 'an Island off Australia', you are 'an Island OF Australia'. My bad!

13:30 - Ivy's unique horsie origin story & gaited horses

26:50.954 - Swagger's story

32:13 - how Swagger came to be with Ivy & initially it seemed it would be easy...

36:57 - but it didn't start well

39:54 - getting out of the rut & getting some help

42:13 - help that's remote

43:60 - starting to slowly solve Swagger's disengagement

48:44 - a break-through and the progress snowball starting to slowly roll

51:56 - the approach for Swagger's care & welfare needs, particularly hoof care

1:03:11 - developing Swagger's environmental curiosity

1:04:35 - the highlights reel from February 2024 onward

1:09: 43 - coaching support with Michelle

1:13:44 - what MAYBE next

1:15:14 - Ivy's biggest learnings & recommendations

1:21:15 - supporting Swagger's journey & finding Ivy

1:24:14 - further thoughts

1:26:47 - wrapping-up with Swagger & Ivy's gift to us & what's on next week

Links from Ivy:

Go Fund Me link: https://gofund.me/83d83a1f

Facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/IvysHorses

Website: www.IvysHorses.com

Our links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com

S5 E2: The Hard

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 12 Nov 2024 19:00:00 +0000

Today, I want to speak about ‘the hard’ in horses. I recently shared a post on our Abbey’s Run Equestrian Facebook page about this & it resonated with a lot of people.

This topic is inspired by those who in the past few months have shared their hard with me, just how tough-a time they’ve had of it, and the thinking and reflection that those conversations have left me with.

I don’t think we share enough about the hard and so this episode aims to change that.

In this episode we discuss:

1:20 - episode introduction

2:54 - what do I mean by ‘the hard’

5:06 - some examples

6:20 - the unwell, the injuries & the impact

10:17 - resource limitations, access limitations & financial strain

19:50 - social media’s role

21:49 - human health impacts

23:47 - what do we do about it?

27:19 - episode wrap-up & what’s on next week

Links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com

S5 E1: Introducing a new horse - with Dorothy Heffernan

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels, Dorothy Heffernan) — Tue, 5 Nov 2024 19:00:00 +0000

I’m delighted to be starting Season 5 of An Equine Conversation with a returning and very popular past guest, Dr Dorothy Heffernan.

In today’s episode, we catch-up, get an update on Rio, Dorothy’s New Forest pony with Equine Metabolic Syndrome (although, this was recorded back in August 2024, so there’s likely already another update due) and then we get onto today’s topic of how to set everyone up for the best chance of success when introducing a new horse to a herd.

If you’ve not encountered Dorothy before, let me suggest jumping back and listening to Season 3, Episode 8, our first episode with Dorothy to hear more about her horsie origin story.

Dorothy Heffernan:

Dorothy Heffernan, PhD was born and raised in Dublin in the Republic of Ireland, where she was a horse and pony mad child. She moved to Scotland to study psychology and took her love of all things equid with her.

After graduating with a PhD from the University of Strathclyde in Glasgow, she chose to specialize in equine behavior and has been working as an equine behavior consultant for 17 years, helping people solve behavior challenges with their horses, ponies, donkeys and mules. In 2021, she joined with three other force-free equid trainers to launch Positive Equine Training Scotland, offering support and training to people in Scotland who want to learn about new gentle and compassionate ways of working with their equid friends. Getting to meet and work with a variety of equids, big, small, long and short eared has been Dorothy’s dream all her life, and now she’s living that dream.

As well as teaching and helping with equid behaviour issues, Dorothy supervises research projects for the University of Edinburgh courses in Equine Science and Animal Behaviour & Welfare. She has her own three lovely equid friends who take up either far too much (or not nearly enough) of her time, all trained using force free positive reinforcement methods.

Photo of Dorothy thanks to El Dunlop Photograph, https://www.eldunlop.com/

In this episode we discuss:

1:23 - episode & guest introduction

3:15 - catching-up on what happened since last episode

6:17 - Rio - a brief re-cap on his history

9:40 - the past few months with Rio

19:10 - onto today’s topic - introducing a new horse to the herd

21:01 - where to start

28:01 - the challenges of social skills for those highly domesticated horses

31:43 - post-inhibitory rebound

32:57 - setting up for introduction success

41:24 - quarantine/isolation for the new horse?

46:30 - ‘it depends’ on your unique context

48:10 - where to get support

53:19 - our case study: introducing Affie & Wren to the herd

1:00:52 - wrapping up, further learning with Dorothy & I, and what’s on next week

Links from Dorothy:

Find Dorothy via her Facebook profile
Or at Dorothy’s website: Light Touch Equine

Our links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com

S5: Trailer

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 29 Oct 2024 19:00:00 +0000

Why hello there listener,

I'm Sarah Nickels, your host, and I am delighted let you know that Season 5 of An Equine Conversation starts next Wednesday. As always, Season 5 includes 8 episodes, released weekly on a Wednesday morning (Melbourne time).

Be sure to subscribe so you never miss an episode & please tell everyone about An Equine Conversation so that we can get more great information to more lovely people.

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production and consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com

S4 E8: Equine Scent Detection with Dee Horwood & Cortney McCartney

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Dee Horwood, Cortney McCartney, Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 21 May 2024 20:00:00 +0000

This is the FINAL EPISODE of our Special Edition Season of An Equine Conversation on ‘What Else Is There?’ besides riding.

Last but by no means least, I’m absolutely delighted to welcome our Australian guests for the season, Dee Horwood & Cortney McCartney, owners of the business Scent Horses Australia.

Cortney is, I think, only the 2nd person we’ve had on the podcast who I’ve actually met in person, and lives only 2 hours from me. Not only that but Cortney’s horse, the one used to proof the scent detecting concept is a half sibling to my horse Rufus, so technically, we’re like extended family yea?

Dee & Cortney are joining me to share their story of getting involved in Equine Scent Detection training fun – a journey that was inspired by a conversation Cortney had when visiting Canada back in I think it was 2011. We’re talking about the awesomeness that is scent detecting with equines. This was such a fun conversation and these humans have such a great story.

I’m so excited to help raise the profile of what’s possible here & what these two awesome humans are getting up to.

At the end of the episode, stay tune for a bunch of end of Season announcements.

Dee Horwood & Cortney McCartney - Scent Horses Australia:

Cortney McCartney and Dee Horwood first met in 2003 whilst they were going through police recruit training. Both did a stint in Alice Springs General Duties Policing before transferring to specialist units.

Dee went to the Dog Operations Unit where she completed a 3 month drug detection course in Canberra with Australian Border Force. She completed further dog patrol courses with both the Northern Territory and New Zealand Police forces and a Therapy dog course. She is the first and only female Police dog handler to serve in Northern Territory Police forces Dog Operations Unit.

Cortney went to the Mounted Police Unit, where she worked on improving the quality of service and support the Unit could provide to general duties officers and other specialised units. She attended and trained with the Western Australian Mounted Police and rode with the Royal Canadian Mounted Police Musical Ride. It was whilst Cortney was in Canada that she first heard of “sniffer horses”.

Her curiosity got the better of her and she decided to see if she could train a horse to detect substances to help improve and enhance the Mounted Police’ capabilities. There was only one minor hiccup in her plan - she knew nothing about scent detection but knew that with the right guidance it could work.

It was just fortunate that Dee had transferred to Darwin and was located right next door to the Mounted Police Unit and thought the idea was awesome!

The pair worked together in their spare time training a 3 year old Morgan Horse named Red Bluff Andre who proved to be a keen participant and catapulted them down the path of sniffer horses which led to Scent Horses Australia about 11 years later.

What is ‘scent detecting’ with horses:

It is essentially capturing and using the horses ability to detect and follow scent particles in the air for our benefit.

Horses have the ability to detect scents from ground level up to 2m high which rivals that of a dog. Whilst horses may never replace scenting dogs we can certainly use their keen sense of smell to our advantage.

But I’ll let Cortney & Dee share a whole lot more with you in the episode.

In this episode we discuss:

1:23 - episode introduction

3:20 - introducing Cortney, Dee and equine scent detection

7:47 - what is equine scent work

9.07 - how Dee & Cortney got into equine scent detection

12:47 - when did it all start for you

14:35 - how it went from the start of testing the concept with Andre

17:49 - Andre’s training prior to this

18:25 - learning how to learn

19:30 - how interested were the Police in what you had proved & had to offer

21:04 - Dee’s perspective

24:32 - dog versus horse olfactory system

26:09 - shifting from a police-use focus to setting up Scent Horses Australia

27:20 - the shift from proofing the concept to working with multiple horses

30:30 - the horses catch on quickly, the challenge is more for the handlers

31:43 - scope for more study & volunteer teams, and the initial purpose, evolving to a therapy-type process

36:15 - is there a common scent or food used to start with & how to decide what to use to start with

39:33 - breadth of detection & future potential

43:21 - for adults and children

44:17 - what’s coming

46:46 - where to find out more

47:46 - season 4 wrap-up & a whole bunch of announcements

Links from Dee & Cortney:

Scent Horses Australia on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100086468871058

Scent Horses Australia on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/scenthorsesaustralia?igsh=YWtuNzhhbGduOHlt&utm_source=qr

Our links mentioned this episode:

FB: https://www.facebook.com/peggyhogan1?mibextid=ZbWKwL

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com

S4 E7: Cooperative Care with Peggy Hogan

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Peggy Hogan, Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 14 May 2024 20:00:00 +0000

In this episode of our Special Edition Season of An Equine Conversation, focusing on ‘What Else Is There?’ besides riding, we welcome the incredibly experienced & knowledgeable, Peggy Hogan to chat with us on the topic of Cooperative Care.

Cooperative Care may be a new term for some of you. It’s something that is used or can, or we could perhaps say should be used widely in the animal world, including with our equines. But I’ll let Peggy tell you more on this shortly.

Some people may think of Cooperative care as boring, but I think it is anything but & find it amazing & totally fascinating. I know Peggy shares my feelings and has done a heap of learning about & exploring cooperative care with the equines in her world.

Cooperative care is something we could and really should all be training with our horses, to make daily care activities a breeze & emergency care activities less stressful. It also has the most wonderful flow-on effects to all our training and the relationship we have with our equines, so it is well worth investing our time into.

A few notes on this episode for you…

It was very remiss of me, in this conversation, not to invite Peggy to introduce herself more fully to you. I’ve no doubt many of you will already be familiar with Peggy’s work, but not everyone will. I can tell you that Peggy & I have already spoken about another podcast episode conversation we’d like to record and so I’ll make sure we capture Peggy’s story then.

Just a couple of things or people Peggy mentions this episode that it’s just worth defining for you:

Dr Susan Friedman has a business called Behavior Works, the US spelling of Behavior, and runs courses through that platform for those of us in the animal training sphere. I’ve participated twice in the Living and Learning with Animals course – which I know Peggy has attended many, many times.

Clicker Expo – this is an annual, now twice annual conference event run by Karen Pryor Academy based in the US. In late January, early February-ish is a virtual expo, which means those of us living far away can attend live & watch back recordings. There’s also an in-person Expo that happens too. I’ve attended the virtual Clicker Expo a couple of times now and can say it is full of so much inspiring, educational information and practical things to play with, with our animal friends.

There are more people mentioned and terms used like in every episode, that I missed catching & defining for you, but hopefully you get the gist enough and can start looking things up that peak you’re interest… and also, we have more to discuss in future episodes.

Join Peggy and I now, as we delve into the world of Cooperative Care… with us attempting great restraint on not getting too far into the training weeds … and they were some tempting weeds I tell you but we managed to mostly stay on track.

Peggy Hogan:

Through her business, The Best Whisper is a Click, Peggy Hogan has traveled internationally providing clicker training clinics, and more recently, online coaching and courses generously sharing knowledge of Clicker Training horses. She has been a speaker at Clicker Expo since 2013.

Her background in training includes Natural Horsemanship and an in-depth study of the teachings of Peggy Cummings, founder of Connected Riding.

In the late 90's there was little information on using positive reinforcement with horses, so after an introduction from Alexandra Kurland, Peggy learned from professional clicker trainers of many other species, world renowned trainers like Ken Ramirez, as well as diving into the science behind the training with Dr. Susan Friedman.

Peggy has investigated ways to add more shaping, capturing, luring, and targeting to her clicker training for horses program. Horses offer complex behaviors freely if given the choice, behaviors that range from agility to freestyle to husbandry to medical procedures. Peggy is currently teaming up with Monty Gwynne from Equispeak to reach the online community for teaching this amazing technology.

In this episode we discuss:

1:24 - episode introduction & notes

5:39 - introducing & welcoming Peggy Hogan

8:50 - what is ‘cooperative care’?

12:32 - in what context is it used - what does it look like / what is it used for?

19:07 - how much easier so many activities become with cooperation

24:21 - cooperative care in Zoo’s versus in the equine world & the need to know how to train that’s built into ownership

27:27 - with most horse owners being female, needing to empower & take care of ourselves without the fight

28:32 - misused of the word ‘liberty’ and defining what that means in Peggy’s world

30:41 - how did Peggy get interested in cooperative care

32.43 - exploring what could develop when the animal had more control & being inspired by a YouTube video

33.57 - collaborating with Eva Bertilsson & Emelie Johnson Vegh & presenting at Clicker Expo on ‘Animals in Control’ & the beginning of the ‘start buttons’ label

35.16 - is cooperative care for all equines? & the difference between emergencies & our ‘bread & butter’ training

39:24 - a little training can go a long way

41:06 - where to begin

45:07 - moving from ‘start buttons’ to ‘continue buttons’, having a ‘stop button’ & taking a ‘no’ as data, not personally

51:35 - cognitive dissonance trips us all up in our journey’s sometimes: more about the concept of & label that is ‘respect’

55:08 - cooperative care is a label too - what does it really mean

55:52 - painting a picture for you

1:00:55 - when learning for cooperative care, it extends to everything - it’s a gold mine

1:06:03 - ‘discretionary effort’ & it can be scary initially, when an animal offers

1:08:15 - where to find out more

1:10:55 - recapping & the power of filming & reviewing your training

1:15:13 - learning it right the first time is way easier than having to fix problems created when learning with poor information - learn from experienced coaches/instructors/trainers

1:18:16 - episode wrap-up & what’s coming up at Abbey’s Run & next week

Links from Peggy:

Home: www.thebestwhisperisaclick.com

Courses: www.clickertraininghorses.com/store

FB business page: https://www.facebook.com/ClickerTrainingHorses?mibextid=ZbWKwL

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/clickertraininghorses?igsh=OGQ5ZDc2ODk2ZA==

YouTube: https://youtube.com/@PeggyHogan?feature=shared

Our links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com

S4 E6: Equine enrichment with Maja Bagdziun

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Maja Badgziun, Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 7 May 2024 20:00:00 +0000

I’m excited to introduce our next topic & guest on our Special Edition Season of An Equine Conversation, focusing on ‘What Else Is There?’ besides riding.

I suspect some of your will be familiar with the work of Maja Bagdziun. Maja shares a heap of beautiful, inspiring training videos through her Facebook page: Hear Your Horse Whisper - science based information and education and two Facebook groups: Enrichment for Horses and No Drama Pony Training.

Once again, An Equine Conversation is giving me an excuse to speak to yet another individual who’s work I have been admiring for some time. I find Maja’s training lovely to watch, very creative and inspiring, using the environment she has to work with and a bunch of lateral thinking.

I love enrichment as something we can do with our equine’s that has loads of benefits and is a pretty easy and can be very cost-effective activity. I know how much I enjoy working with my herd on different enrichment activities & I wanted to share this with you. I know that Maja too is passionate about using enrichment as part of her ponies lives… and I imagine too for her new goat additions – you’ll have to watch her Facebook spaces to see more of goat training fun as well.

I strongly suspect that some of you are already using enrichment with your equines, whether you give it that label or not, and those who aren’t will likely be heading outside to play after listening to this episode.

I’ll stop here and introduce Maja and let her tell us a heap more.

Maja Bagdziun:

Maja is an animal lover who has committed time to explore behavioural science, ethology, cognition, affective neuroscience (emotions), calming signals and enrichment in dogs and horses. She uses an evidence based approach to work with animals and positive reinforcement is her main tool of interaction and training.

Having had graduated with Educational Psychology she has the academic background that helps her to understand how not just humans but also animals learn.

She's passionate about modern horse training that incorporates cognition, emotion, ethology, biology and attachment theory which allows her to consider an animal in front of her in a holistic way.

She's passionate about sharing her knowledge and skills with the others and runs a Facebook Page and Groups that are dedicated to education, science based training and interactions with horses as well as providing everyday enrichment ideas to help make horses lives better.

‘Enrichment For Horses’ Facebook group:

Maja set up her Enrichment for Horses group in 2019 with the original aim to share her own experience of exposing her rescue ponies to enrichment items to stimulate their natural SEEKING system, curiosity and cognitive skills.

She started off with introducing a novel item each day but quickly learned that this was not an appropriate approach for her rescue pony Charisma who needed predictability and consistency to learn to trust the humans and his new environment. This lead Maja to abandon the original idea of introducing items everyday and instead she's opened to group to public audience and invited people to share their own ideas while taking a slower and more predictable approach in her own enrichment journey with her ponies. The group has since grown massively and has now got over 35k followers.

In this episode we discuss:

1:21 - episode introduction

2:13 - introducing Maja & the Enrichment For Horses Facebook group

9:40 - what is ‘enrichment’ and what is it for equines?

10:57 - how did Maja get interested in enrichment for horses

12:27 - the rescue ponies: Cracker & Charisma

14:03 - more about the ponies

17:36 - what motivated you to set up the Enrichment For Horses Fb group

20:06 - why provide enrichment?

26:42 - enrichment in the Zoo world

30:39 - building curiosity, focus, & the importance of teaching horses to participate in enrichment

32:23 - ‘real-world’ benefits of equines engaging in enrichment

35:32 - enrichment with or without food

43:00 - giving fearful horses the opportunities to learn & needing to help the animal learn how to engage

48:36 - behaviour modelling

52:39 - enrichment activity examples

1:01:47 - another benefit & more examples

1:05:59 - safety warning - common sense required

1:09:42 - where to find out more

1:10:47 - episode wrap-up, keeping in touch & what’s on next week

Links from Maja:

Hear Your Horse Whisper - science based information and education - Facebook Page: https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100063798690549
Enrichment For Horses - Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/2609672455794356/?ref=share
No Drama Pony Training - Facebook Group: https://m.facebook.com/groups/1588766501481423/?ref=share

Enrichment topics:

Working for food as Enrichment - Contra Free Loading: https://www.facebook.com/share/v/WTUUSg29PCaHB2B6/?ref=share
Cognitive Enrichment - Problem Solving: https://fb.watch/rqcBZXdCtZ/
Environmental Enrichment - life on tracks: https://www.facebook.com/share/v/uj1yrKF1JUXyU4ee/
Environmental Enrichment - feeing in multiple places: https://www.facebook.com/share/p/XmvFvpWEmnjH8Ghh/
Combining training with Enrichment: https://fb.watch/rqcHDFdF1i/
Play in Enriched Environment: https://www.facebook.com/share/v/4Pm9BMiQ2E5wpNcK/
Enrichment Playground: https://www.facebook.com/share/p/Vqacq9Gzx8gzxH9t/
Jonny enrichment: https://www.facebook.com/share/v/HWVfpoueQUF4WWmQ/

Our links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com

S4 E5: Horse Play with Nicky Ross

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Nicky Ross, Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 30 Apr 2024 20:00:00 +0000

This episode of our Special Edition Season on ‘What Else Is There?’ we are connecting with the far west coast of Scotland to speak with today’s guest Nicky Ross, owner of the business Horse Play.

I first discovered Nicky some years back through a training group we were both in on Facebook and I saw some of the lovely videos she was sharing of her work, teaching one of her ponies to go in harness, purely training using positive reinforcement. Nicky was based in England at that point, and then I watched from afar as Nicky and family moved to Scotland – much jealously from us, except for the midges – to the far west coast. Since then, Nicky has evolved her activities with her ponies and her human learners to work with the amazing environment there.

I really enjoy seeing what Nicky and crew are getting up to – things that I can only dream about where I am. Once again, the beauty of having a podcast means I could reach out & was so pleased to have the opportunity to speak with Nicky and hear more about her background, approach, the diversity activities that go on, and what makes Nicky’s heart smile & feel true in how she connects and helps her human learners connect with equines. I really resonate with a lot of Nicky’s approach and I’m delighted to share some more inspiration with you, our listeners this episode.

Nicky Ross:

Nicky Ross an equine behaviourist and teacher living in the Highlands of Scotland with her family, a little herd of Shetland ponies and 5 rabbits! Nicky has always loved all things horse and began teaching horse behaviour to children, adults and professionals 10 years ago. Nicky has a passion for improving equine welfare through giving people the knowledge, skills and understanding to view the world through their horse's eyes.

Horse Play:

Originally founded when Nicky and her family lived in Yorkshire, Horse Play is all about sharing a passion for equine behaviour and wellbeing with others. Through fun, practical experiences with the herd, we explore the Highlands whilst gaining amazing insights into the horse’s mind.

In this episode we discuss:

1:26 - episode introduction

3:03 - introducing Nicky & Horse Play

4:25 - the landscape that forms a large part of the adventures

7:10 - actively choosing the place

9:39 - the story & evolution of Horse Play - the amazing learning experiences

16:12 - Nicky’s horsie origins

20:07 - learning the most from the horses

22:10 - Nicky’s equine team

24:39 - small versus riding horses - the conversations possible

27:32 - Pixie’s driving

31:28 - the diversity of activities

39:48 - the word ‘liberty’ & what that means in Nicky’s world

45:21 - similarities & differences between big and little

48:42 - people facing their own (long-time, intergenerational) learning history & the challenge with choice & the paradigm shift

57:12 - how you can get involved

1:02:57 - even more adventures

1:06: 05 - episode wrap-up & what’s coming up at Abbey’s Run & next week

Links from Nicky:

Website, https://horseplay.horse/

New Online Course: Horse Play At Home, https://www.horseplayhighlands.com/pl/2148332144

Free Webinar sharing the secrets of how we're able to work with our horses at liberty with only minimal training, https://nicky-ross.mykajabi.com/pl/2148295556

Our links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com

S4 E4: An Owner's Story - with Chris & Michael

Tue, 23 Apr 2024 20:00:00 +0000

This episode of our Special Edition Season on ‘What Else Is There?’ takes a little bit of a different view. Today, instead of us meeting with those who engage in this space in a more professional capacity, it is my pleasure to introduce you to a couple who are horse-owners and to share their, very personal but very inspiring journey.

I connected with Chris and Michael Fallon, based in the United States, as a result of the post I put up and shared into the Non Ridden Equine Facebook group, asking what fun, non-ridden activities were people getting up to with their equine friends. Chris posted a comment that included the most delightful video montage of a bunch of tricks their horse Pirate was doing, many with her husband Michael. The video, especially Michael’s joy as he played with Pirate & Pirates engagement, made me chuckle, filled me with joy and I made a point of showing it to Benn, for him to see another male having fun in this way. We were both tickled.

So I reached out to Chris and invited her and Michael to join me for a conversation, to share their experiences with you as other owners who are not professionals in the ethical horse world. To my delight, they were happy to chat with me so that their story could inspire others. I think a really key part of Chris and Michael’s story is that their horse Pirate CAN be ridden at this point, unlike Vicki’s Kez that we spoke about last week. Pirate can be ridden and still they are having a fabulous time with him from the ground.

I am incredibly grateful to Chris and Michael for meeting with me and so openly sharing this personal story with me and now you. I hope it leaves you feeling inspired about what’s possible with your equine friends.

Chris & Michael Fallon:

Chris and Michael currently live in Garnet Valley, Pennsylvania. Chris has two children; Bobby and Melanie and two grandchildren. Chris received her bachelor’s degree in Elementary Education/Psychology from Millersville State University and her master’s degree in Strategic Leadership from Neumann University. Chris is currently the Cooperative Education Coordinator at Delaware County Technical High Schools and has been in that position for 19 years. Chris has played the piano since she was 3 years old and enjoys music, photography, traveling, spending time with her grandchildren and wastes time buying things from Amazon and returning them. Michael received his degree in Hotel and Restaurant Management from Penn State University and is a construction superintendent for a general contractor. He has been an indentured servant for way too long and is hoping to retire if he hits the lottery. Michael enjoys collecting junk, traveling and snoring.

Pirate:

Pirate is a 14-year-old black, quarter horse gelding. He is boarded at Cloverleaf Stables in Chadds Ford, PA. His favorite activities are eating everything in sight and training his owners to scratch him and play with him. He likes to search everyone’s grain bucket hoping that there could be some kernels left behind. Pirate has also become a connoisseur of fine fruits and vegetables. He has taught his Mike and Chris to forget the crappy supermarket food; only expensive fruits and vegetables that have been organically grown will suit his refined palate. Pirate has also been Chris’ therapist which he does free of charge. After Chris sustained a severe, non-horse related injury, Chris enjoys just sitting in the pasture with Pirate and doing nothing. The therapist that Chris had to pay suggested that she find ways to “stay in the moment” to help cope with the mental effects of a permanent disability. Since horses live in the moment, just hanging out with Pirate has helped her to relax and not focus on her injury. Pirate has owned Chris and Michael Fallon since February, 2019.

In this episode we discuss:

1:25 - episode introduction

3:30 - introducing Chris, Michael & Pirate

5:47 - podcasting in PJs & snow

8:09 - the montage video & becoming horsie folk

12:31 - Skittles

15:20 - Pirate

16:17 - Chris’s (non-horsie) accident & the flow-on impacts

19:11 - Michael’s influence & finding clicker training, the spark & the fun

23:06 - how what’s done with Pirate relates to working with kids & the importance of setting them up for success with the environment, especially equipment

25:12 - using your imagination & wandering the toy aisle

26:18 - where we train: giving choice & capturing behaviours

31:08 - unexpected but good things that positive reinforcement training has let to

33:13 - wanting to overcome the fear & the shift that the changed training can give

33:36 - applying the same training approach to ourselves as we would our horses

37:44 - Pirate’s story

42:56 - seeds planted & the barn’s response

47:28 - what gets the strangest looks

49:08 - Pirate’s ‘voice’

51:25 - talking through the video montage & other activities in Pirate’s repertoire

1:01:17 - different relationships

1:04:48 - the snowball rolling down the hill - learning how to learn & the speed of learning that leads to

1:06: 05 - episode wrap-up & what’s coming up at Abbey’s Run & next week

Our links mentioned this episode:

From Green to Growth: developing positive partnerships for the future

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com

S4 E3: 'The Non Ridden Equine' Facebook group - with Vicki Yates

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Vicki Jayne Yates, Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 16 Apr 2024 20:00:00 +0000

In this episode of our Special Edition Season on ‘What Else Is There?’, I’m delighted to introduce you to Vicki Jayne Yates and the Facebook group she established with her husband Steve, ‘The Non Ridden Equine’.

This free group that continues to grow weekly with a current membership of over 32,000 people from around the world. I’ve been a member for a number of years now and love being part of such an inclusive, welcoming group and a place where I can draw inspiration on ideas of what activities I can be doing with my horses besides riding.

I wanted to showcase this community to you because I think we can sometimes feel isolated and perhaps lonely if we’re not riding. So much is focused on the ridden world and there can be peer-pressure to ride, I know I’ve faced it. I want you to know that if you are not riding your equines or even if you are, that there is this amazing, international community out there that you can be part of if you’re not already. There are SO many people around the world who have equines that they don’t ride & enjoy in other ways. The Non Ridden Equine Facebook group is somewhere that you can find connection and possibly some inspiration too (listen next week for more on this).

I also find Vicki and Steve’s story with Kez, which inspired the establishment of the group very powerful and wanted to share that with you too.

Enjoy & see you in The Non Ridden Equine Facebook group soon.

Vicki Jayne Yates:

Vicki is an artist, Reiki healer, animal communicator and founder of the original Non Ridden Equine Facebook group. Vicki has many years’ experience in the equine industry. Her horsemanship approach has been showcased many times in published articles in magazines. Vicki is passionate out non ridden equines and the many lessons we can learn side by side from equines.

Vicki’s passion for non ridden equines comes from years of seeing first-hand how disadvantaged they are in a world in love with riding. Vicki and her husband Steve’s own horse Kez cannot be ridden due to his health conditions. He is a daily reminder that more must be done for non ridden equines. Not all are lucky to have guardians who love unconditionally.

Vicki and Steve set up the original Non Ridden Equine Facebook group. Tens of thousands of people have joined. It was clear that social media is a fantastic way to connect and share stories.

Kez has his own social media page and Vicki has also created free non ridden resources for all and called it Kez’s Club.

On a very personal level Vicki has been on profound and life changing journeys with my own equines. Each has gifted her insights and knowledge. Lessons can be deep, personal and take us out of our comfort zones into new learning. The bond between 2 souls is real and spiritual.

The Non Ridden Equine Facebook group

This is the original Non Ridden Equine group on Facebook and is the pioneer in raising the non-ridden agenda and influencing change. It has gone global with members worldwide. The group is not an anti-riding group.

Horses are not born with tack. Plenty cannot be ridden or driven for many reasons. Some people choose not to ride. The non ridden equine is often over looked and under-valued. This Facebook group has been created to celebrate the many joys non-ridden equines can bring to us. It is a place people can exchange ideas and experiences of enjoyment of the non-ridden equine. Plus show off their beautiful equines. People who ride are also welcome. As everything non-ridden is great for ridden equines too. Riding is wonderful if it is ethical and FUN for both horse and human.

In this episode we discuss:

1:21 - episode introduction

3:23 - introducing Vicki & The Non Ridden Equine Facebook group

5:46 - a thank you & Vicki’s story of finding this passion

8:36 - the personal journey that led to the group’s creation: Kez’s story

12:22 - setting up the Facebook group, & going global

14:06 - who is Kez?

15:56 - the importance of persevering to figure out what’s going on to know what you’re dealing with & being aware of who any treatment is actually for

18:54 - the group & how it ‘ticks’

23:00 - importance of a safe space to share personal journey’s & a long intergenerational history

26:00 - how young it starts & a different way

30:34 - diversity in the group

32:39 - what do people share in the group - what are the diverse activities do people get up to?

38:21 - how to find the group to join in & the benefits of non-ridden activities to ALL equines

40:35 - episode wrap-up & what’s on An Equine Conversation next week

Links from Vicki:

The Non Ridden Equine Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/thenonriddenhorse

Website: www.VickiJayneYates.co.uk

Kez’s Club: www.vickijayneyates.co.uk/kezs-club.html

Kez’s Facebook Page: https://www.facebook.com/kezthenonriddencob

Our links mentioned this episode:

From Green to Growth: developing positive partnerships for the future

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com

S4 E2: Equine Agility - with Ellen Cochrane

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Ellen Cochrane, Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 9 Apr 2024 20:00:00 +0000

I’m so excited to introduce today, our first guest of our Special Edition Season on ‘What Else Is There?’ (besides riding).

I’ll be straight with you and say that one of the joys of podcasting is having a reason to speak to some awesome humans in our industry, because uh, I want to connect with them myself, and today is no exception.

Ellen Cochrane came on my radar a couple of years ago, when someone shared the footage of Ellen’s mule Inara, pushing a soccer ball around an S-bend of poles. It was posted on Ellen’s page that follow’s Inara’s journey, ‘It’s a Mule’s Life’ and it was amazing. This was clearly someone who was a very clever trainer and able to achieve awesome things, and so I started following Ellen’s work.

In parallel with this and probably even before I knew of Ellen, I had heard about Equine Agility and was captivated by the idea. There is so much I love about this as an activity we can be doing with our horses for fun, that hones our training skills broadly with lots of real-world positive impacts, and it also facilitates those who have a competitive drive to compete, while still keeping their horse comfortable as possible as the entries are submitted from home. It’s something that can be done un-mounted on lead and off-lead and also done mounted. There are so many options and the creators have made this opportunity inclusive for so many equines and their humans. I can’t wait to explore it with my equine team.

But, let me stop there as Ellen will explain so much more in the conversation you’re about to hear.

I will just say that I’ll be speaking with Ellen again soon in a future Season of An Equine Conversation as there are so many more things we want to share with you.

Ellen Cochrane

Ellen Cochrane, based in England, first discovered Horse Agility when working with a client with a disability who wanted something safe she could do with her new horse. Ellen thought it was brilliant decided to get involved herself as a way of providing some focus into training her rescue mule, Inara, and to help build her confidence. Inara and Ellen both really enjoyed Agility and progressed through the levels with Ellen then stepping into the role of a Horse Agility Accredited Trainer. This meant Ellen could coach other people officially and run clinics. Over the years, Inara & Ellen had won a few titles, but in 2022, they hit the big ones and became Horse Agility World Champion both on-lead and Liberty. Ellen then chose to retire from competing to instead get involved from the other side, joining the Horse Agility Club as a judge, course designer and certificate course coach. Ellen also teaches Horse Agility in “real life” and runs clinics and camps. Ellen is also a positive reinforcement trainer working with various clients, and is the owner of I think it was also 7 equines, just like we have here, although unlike us, Ellen has a mule in the mix.

Photo of Ellen & Inara thanks to: Catchphrase Photography

International Horse Agility Club

The International Horse Agility Club was founded by Vanessa Bee in December 2009, and has become a fast-growing equine sport. Horse Agility sees you navigate a series of obstacles with your horse with a focus on working together as a team. The club runs monthly competitions in both on-lead classes and liberty classes, as well as Equagility classes which are ridden. We also have a special Junior course for our young members, a Young Horse class for our young horses, and even an Any Other Animal class for anything from a guinea pig to a llama and everything in between! The main competitions are online video competitions which means you can compete from the comfort of your horse’s home. We also have special Walking Only classes for those equines or people who have difficulties going faster than a walk. The Walk Only classes are not easier – but rather focus on more technical movements. The Horse Agility Club also have a 10-level certificate course program, for those who might not want to compete, or those who want a bit more support in their journey as they work their way through with a mentor.

In this episode we discuss:

1:23 - episode introduction

3:23 - introducing Ellen Cochrane & the International Horse Agility Club

6:05 - welcoming Ellen & how clever our animals are

8:44 - what even is 'equine agility’ & how is that different to dog agility?

12:22 - competing from home versus travelling = inclusive

14:00 - how did Ellen get into agility?

18:04 - winning rosettes, Inara’s progression to the top & transitioning to the ‘other side’ of the Club

23.13 - options for competition participation

29:39 - course program

31:41 - giving training a focus & can you miss a month?

33:21 - are there equines that can’t or shouldn’t do agility - catering to different abilities

36:05 - how many people are involved & from where

37:42 - the community

39:31 - a growing activity & inspiring other people

43:20 - how the judging works

47:05 - coming up with the obstacles

49:38 - ‘real-world’ outcomes as a result of the agility training

55:21 - thanks to Vanessa for establishing the Club

56:42 - the potential for equine agility to be done within an existing group or club

57:44 - where to find out more

58:35 - episode wrap-up

59:33 - activities happening this month with Abbey’s Run Equestrian & what’s on An Equine Conversation next week

Links from Ellen:

Website: https://www.thehorseagilityclub.com/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/TheHorseAgilityClub

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/horseagilityclub/

Our links mentioned this episode:

From Green to Growth: developing positive partnerships for the future

Finessing The Fundamentals (2-day, in-person workshop on 20 & 21 April, 2024)

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com

S4 E1: Why this special edition season - 'What Else Is There?'

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 2 Apr 2024 19:00:00 +0000

I have spent many hours thinking about bringing this Special Edition Season of An Equine Conversation to you, and then of course planning & sourcing guests & editing episodes.

The more I thought about it, the more and more important and the clearer the WHY for this episode became to me. And it seemed more than what was sensible to fit into the already long Season Trailer, so here we are at Episode 1, talking about the why. Why we are producing a Special Edition of An Equine Conversation on ‘What else is there?’.

In this episode we discuss:

1:43 - episode introduction

2:15 - first, some cool podcast stats & thanks to you

6:22 - the problem for the horses

10:22 - the challenge the humans can face

12:32 - what we want to do this season

13:56 - the list we heard from you so far

17:03 - episode wrap-up

18:21 - April 2024 activities & what’s on next week’s episode

Links mentioned this episode:

Sign-up to our free 90min workshop on the 10th of April

Finessing the Fundamentals: 2-day, in person workshop in April

From Green to Growth: developing positive partnerships for the future

Reliable Recall Challenge (for horse & pony owners)

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com

S4: Trailer

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 26 Mar 2024 19:00:00 +0000

Hello lovely listener!
I am so excited to be back & bringing you this, our first Special Edition Season of An Equine Conversation.

Just like previous Seasons of the podcast, Season 4 includes 8 episodes, the first of which will drop next Wednesday.

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production and consultation. If you'd like him to help with your podcast, get in touch by email at business@mbpod.com

S3 E8: An Irish start & another EMS pony - with Dorothy Heffernan

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (dorothy heffernan, Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 21 Nov 2023 19:00:00 +0000

Here we are at our final episode for Season 3 of An Equine Conversation. The months & months of recording & editing have all finally finished & you now have the whole season to listen to & what an epic season it has been too.

Stay tuned at the end of the conversation for some announcements.

I’m delighted to bring you this final episode with the 4th inspirational women in the horse world I’ve had the pleasure of speaking with this season.

This is yet another conversation I’ve been so looking forward to having and to sharing with you. Dr Dorothy Heffernan is based in Scotland, my favourite place in the world besides where I am in Victoria, Australia, but grew up in Ireland. I mention in the conversation, an Irish documentary that was on TV when I was a child about horses in Ireland and so I always wondered what it would have been like growing up horsie in Ireland. You’ll never believe it, but someone’s put that 53 minute and a bit documentary, which must have been made in the 1980’s or even 70’s onto YouTube. I almost fell off my chair when I thought to look and found it.

I digress…

Dorothy first came on my radar a number of years ago with her insightful responses to questions on some of the equine behaviour & positive reinforcement Facebook groups & it seemed Dorothy liked mine too & we connected over a like-minded approach.

Since then I’ve been following Dorothy’s journey with both her training work with humans & horses in Scotland, and with her own little herd of horses. I knew Dorothy grew up in Ireland and I wanted to hear what that was like & I love Scotland so am always happy to speak with anyone there.

I know some of you lovely listeners had really resonated with & appreciated hearing Julia Inglis story with her EMS horse and you wanted more information around EMS – a growing challenge for many horse owners. Dorothy has an EMS pony Rio – whose story I wanted to share with you as well, so we delve into the trials and tribulations of managing an EMS pony in Scotland.

It was such a fun conversation with Dorothy who is a great story-teller. Even listening back to edit the episode, I laughed and I almost shed tears at different points. I hope you enjoy listening as much as Dorothy & I enjoyed recording this for you.

Dorothy Heffernan:

In this episode we discuss:

1:24 - episode introduction

4:15 - introducing Dr Dorothy Heffernan

4:47 - Scotland: the Scottish summer, loving Scotland & accents/dilects

14:09 - growing up horse-mad in the suburbs of Dublin

16.29 - riding lessons in the middle of Dublin city

18:36 - making the most of horsie extended family

19.55 - eventually Dad bought the horse - perseverance pays off

23:60 - enter Rio

28.11 - enter Mal

30.18 - enter Jackson

25.41 - how studying & teaching in Psychology has informed a change in horse keeping & training

43.56 - Rio’s EMS: the background

52.10 - the laminitis diagnosis, the management & the recovery

54.16 - round 2

56:52 - Rio’s current status: ditching the fat pads & ‘the knife edge’

57.59 - Dorothy’s insights: forage/feed importance, what exercise does

59:28 - a positively trained, EMS pony, the need for exercise & how that was managed

1:00:53 - the positive ripple effects of the exercise training

1:03:16 - Rio’s living set-up & management now - balancing behavioural & health needs

1:05:38 - exercising ‘relatively hard’ - what is hard enough to have a positive impact

1:06:52 - the broader impacts of exercise

1:09:27 - the evolution in the herd dynamics as Rio’s EMS has been managed, his living conditions have been stable & his training has progressed

1:10:37 - Rio & Mal’s earlier relationship & working to train that

1:16:19 - top tips for managing an EMS pony

1:23:57 - episode & season wrap-up

Link from Dorothy:

Find Dorothy via her Facebook profile
Or at Dorothy’s website: Light Touch Equine

Our links mentioned this episode:

Sign-up to our email list
Abbey's Run Equestrian website
Abbey's Run Equestrian on Facebook
Tell us what you thought about Season 3: CLICK HERE to share your thoughts via our short feedback form.

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. You can find out more about podcast support on offer via: https://www.mbpod.com/

S3 E7: The wine cellar

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 14 Nov 2023 19:00:00 +0000

Let me invite you today, to come for a little journey into the wine cellar with me, which is kind of ironic, given I don’t drink alcohol, but hey, I can still appreciate the amazingness that is a wine cellar… so come on this little journey with me.

Why are we going to the wine cellar? Well, for very, very good reason:

Because, we have a tendency to start training our horses on the ground floor or somewhere above it, so, in the middle instead of at the beginning, instead of starting down in the gloriousness that is the wine cellar.

I think we do this for a variety of very legitimate reasons, but it often leads us into a pickle in lots of ways with training our horses where we get ourselves stuck or facing problems.

I hear some of you cry here, ‘but but but, I am not a horse trainer, I am an owner and I work with a trainer so this episode can’t be for me’… and I’m here to tell you that anyone who works with or cares for any animal, anywhere is a trainer – regardless of whether we’re conscious of it or not. So yep, if you care for a horse or any other animal, you are a trainer & this episode, this visit to the wine cellar is for you. As if you don’t want to go to the wine cellar anyway!?

In today’s episode I’m going to speak to the training that comes before the training. Because that piece is inextricably connected to just how successful any training, which I say in inverted commas, is.

So let’s head down the stairs into the cool of the wine cellar together and get started.

In this episode we discuss:

1:22 - episode introduction

3:10 - we so often miss the (training) things that come before & start training somewhere in the middle instead of at the start (or in the wine cellar)

5:37 - there’s a whole lot of training that doesn’t seem like ‘training’ but IS training and has a direct impact on our ‘training’

7:37 - the things that come before the wine cellar - the ‘site preparation’

8:46 - problems in training: symptoms versus causes

9:58 - what’s falls into the category of training that doesn’t seem like training but is training, for you

13:19 - setting up the classroom for student success

14:19 - wine cellar foundations are not something most of us were taught

16:49 - the role that peer pressure (direct or in-direct) plays

19:34 - it’s not rocket science, but we mostly miss them and/or need permission to go there

20:23 - an activity you can do that doesn’t seem like training but absolutely is training

23:30 - another activity to think about how you’d approach in your circumstances

25:54 - episode recap

30.22 - episode wrap-up & what’s on next week

Links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. You can find out more about podcast support on offer via: https://www.mbpod.com/

S3 E6: How learning with horses can teach young people key life skills - with Bex Tasker

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Bex Tasker, Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 7 Nov 2023 19:00:00 +0000

From the age of about 10-11 years old, it was my dream to have my own children’s riding school. I started instructing at 16 and taught a lot of young people. Initially at riding schools & then at Pony Club where I often taught the youngest members, the more junior groups.

In my mid-to-late 20’s, I’d had enough of teaching young people, of dealing with their parents and so I chose to focus on working with adults.

I didn’t realise at that time, that part of the reason I’d had enough was because of the more conventional way I was having to teach people & that this just didn’t sit right with me. At that time, I didn’t know of or see another way. I wasn’t aware of alternative options.

Fast forward to a few years ago, and my initial dream started to re-kindle in a fashion, with sparks, ignited by the work of people like the lovely Bex Tasker from Positively Together in NZ. I started to see a handful of people around the work, having learning adventures with young people that looked absolutely amazing.

This, their approach, different from that conventional way, really got me & I started to have hope that my initial dream, could, in some way, happen in future. For now, this is something that’s still in my future, something I have bubbling along in the back of my mind, but now I have hope. I have hope for amazing alternatives for ways of working with young people and horses, and moreover, I’m so excited by what I’m seeing is possible to support young people learning about working with horses and other species in very cool ways that I wish were around when I was young.

I couldn’t go past inviting Bex to come and have a chat with me here on An Equine Conversation, to share about her own learning journey and how she evolved her career to working with young people & animals, totally busting the myth that it’s something that we shouldn’t do. Bex does amazing work with young people as the learn about training animals and in turn, that’s giving them a bunch of personal development, teaching them invaluable life-skills on how they engage with their peers, families & humans around them. This includes learning about compassion, boundaries, choice & consent. Hugely important life-skills for us all.

I find this work of Bex’s incredibly inspiring, as do others & Bex has more recently started to support other positive reinforcement focused coaches who work with and want to work with young people through her Shaping the Future membership.

This is an episode for anyone who’s involved with young people, not just those in the animal training space. I hope you enjoy and find inspiration in this conversation.

Bex Tasker:

Bex and her family live on a small farm in beautiful Bay of Plenty, New Zealand. Under her business Positively Together, Bex teaches humans in NZ and around the world how to inspire behaviour change in their horses and dogs. Bex is a Karen Pryor Academy Certified Training Partner and has been training with positive reinforcement for over 20 years, being best known for her long-standing passion and speciality in teaching humans about clicker training for horses. However, Positively Together also runs programmes in which youth experience the power of positive reinforcement and see learning and communication in action, as they work hands-on with friendly trained animals (currently there are sheep, horses, chickens, dogs, cows, pigs and rabbits!). The youth programs and multi-species focus have been growing rapidly since 2018 and have become a special passion for Bex and her team.

Positively Together offers a "Junior Animal Trainers" programme, and “PupStars” classes for kids and their dogs. The flagship “Next Gen Trainers” membership for tweens and teens remains the heart project, with the monthly workshops and strong community providing a safe anchor for kids during the challenging teenage years. The focus for all the youth programs is on animal welfare and trainer skills, and the underlying values of compassion, consent, confidence, resilience and respect – for animals, and for humans.

Over the years the videos of these kids classes posted on Positively Together social media pages have prompted enthusiastic enquiries from trainers around the world wanting advice on how to design and launch similar programs. Bex has guided many people through this process one-on-one, but as a firm believer that, as Dr Friedman says, “All of us are smarter than one of us”, a new idea was born. "Shaping the Future" was launched in early 2023. It is an online coaching collective and community where those of us who are passionate about teaching kids and animals can come together to share ideas and advice, gain support, get inspired, and ultimately get started with changing the world! If you have a special interest in this field, in any capacity, Bex and co would love you to join in!

In this episode we discuss:

1:24 - episode introduction

4:40 - introducing Bex Tasker

7:30 - Bex’s horsie start & the realities of paying your own bills

9:21 - reflections & learnings

10:19 - dogs & the return of horses to the forefront of life

11.39 - the disconnect that can exist in how we train dogs versus horses & how Bex started training with the same approach with both

15:43 - the beginning of a career working with training animals

19:44 - a challenging time & a change in career away from animal training, into Criminal & Fraud Intelligence

20:09 - shifting back to training with humans & animals full time & the similarities this has with Intelligence work

24:24 - starting out & forging a new path

28:12 - the advantages to having minimal outside influences

30:06 - building a new community/tribe

32:55 - the irony of the isolation leading to dedication enabling creativity & a better training approach - which led to the creation of community to enable a better training approach for more people (so they don’t feel lonely or isolated) & finding your tribe

34:54 - ‘good training is good training’, the importance of understanding how behaviour & learning works

35:45 - the difference between true isolation & isolation among a group of others when you have different ideas & views, the need to at times create your own community

38:22 - the importance of us being visible so people can see an alternative - ‘just doing what we do & being who we are is actually enough’

41:43 - starting to work with young people in the animal training space - finding what makes your heart smile

44:13 - a collaboration, creating ‘Mane Priority’ events including ‘Dream It, Be It’ - an animal careers expo to show young people & their parents options

46:13 - mentoring teenagers & developing ‘Next Gen Trainers’ in collaboration with a Youth Worker friend

47:15 - trying other things to see which worked best & finding what lights Bex up

48:19 - evolving to add in more species, beyond horses (including the ‘wool puppies’)

51:32 - the learning we can gain from working with multiple species & taking best-practice from outside of the horse world & cooperative care

55:57 - developing young people into nimble trainers: the difference (or not) between training sheep and training horses & learning to adapt training to different species (humans included)

59:49 - we humans are ‘training’ one another all the time, consciously or not & learning to do it well is a great thing - the world would be a better place with more compassion & kindness - bringing the influence we’re having on others to a more conscious level

1:04:00 - animal training teaching young people critical thinking skills

1:05:55 - importance of young people understanding choice & consent & how animal training supports this learning - respecting every species right to say ‘no’ & having your own boundaries

1:11:17 - feedback on the program from students, parents & other observers

1:17:15 - a run-through of Bex’s programs - both for the young & the young at heart (see links below for more information)

1:22:33 - Bex’s top tips for you: have compassion, stay curious, just be you, follow your gut & look outside the horse-world for learning

1:26:26 - resources that Bex likes right now

1:30:23 - episode wrap-up, notes & what’s on next week

Links from Bex:

Website: www.clickertraining.co.nz
Virtual communities and courses: www.positivelytogether.app
Facebook: facebook.com/positive.reinforcement.training
Instagram: instagram.com/positively_together

Our links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. You can find out more about podcast support on offer via: https://www.mbpod.com/

S3 E5: Farts & Unicorns

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 31 Oct 2023 19:00:00 +0000

Today’s episode is a really short & snappy one, dare I say, a mini-sode.

Despite being short, it’s an important one, where I’m sharing 2 valuable training tips that I’ve been talking about with my students for more than a decade: farts & unicorns. These are two training tips you can take away immediately and incorporate into your training.

A short episode, but one I hope you find really helpful.

And now I best explain just what I mean by farts & unicorns. Listen to find out.

In this episode I discuss:

1:17 - episode introduction

1:55 - brain farts

2:14 - what are ‘brain farts’

2:53 - why talk to students and you about this

4:01 - what to do about it

5:36 - unicorn moments

6:02 - what are unicorn moments

7:00 - why should we beware of them

8:10 - what to do about it

9:53 - episode summary

10.16 - podcast wrap-up & what’s on next week

Our links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. You can find out more about podcast support on offer via: https://www.mbpod.com/

S3 E4: A game changing crib-biting study - with Dr Michaela Hempen

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Michaela Hempen, Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 24 Oct 2023 19:00:00 +0000

It was a few years back now when I first heard about Dr Michaela Hempen’s Masters Research on Crib-biting, which, for those uninitiated, is a stereotypic behaviour that horses can develop. I heard about the research and then had the good fortune to see some of the timeline film of the project thanks to Alexandra Kurland.

There is not much now, after so long in the horse world that really captures my attention strongly, but wow, Michaela’s research blew my mind – it still does. I was captivated watching the footage, absolutely glued to the screen to see it all in as much detail as I could take in.

I think the findings from Michaela’s work are absolutely game-changing in terms of how we view, understand and then manage crib-biting in horses. I am so moved by Michaela and the broader teams work in this space and the implications it has for the welfare of cribbing horses. I look forward to further research happening on crib-biting & other equine stereotypies.

Since I heard about this research, anyone mentions crib-biting and I vomit excitement about Michaela’s research all over them… so I was itching to have Michaela come and speak with me to share this with you, our An Equine Conversation listeners so I could point people to this conversation instead of trying to explain the research and findings myself.

There is so much to talk about & this is a long episode… but we still ran out of time & need to talk again.

Dr Michaela Hempen:

She also has a Masters's degree in Equine Science. Her thesis was supervised by Dr Jesus Rosales Ruiz from North Texas University, that we’ll be discussing today.

Horse trainer, author and podcaster Alexandra Kurland of The Clicker Centre,

Anja Beran, head of the internationally renowned ‘Gut Rosenhof’ training centre in Germany who uses classical dressage as physiotherapy for horses, and

the Feldenkrais method which has been integral to the improvement of Michaela’s riding and interaction with horses.

These 3 things have been to a lesser extent, all part of my journey too, so I resonate with Michaela’s journey.

Also, in 2022, Michaela taught students of a German certification programme for horse-assisted interventions.

In this episode we discuss:

1:30 - episode introduction

3:20 - introducing Dr Michaela Hempen

6:39 - Michaela’s early horsie life

9:12 - enter ‘Asfaloth’

10:00 - starting with classical dressage & a turning point in Michaela’s journey leading to clicker training & Alexandra Kurland

11:57 - continuing with classical dressage & Anja Beran: discovering her work & just how beneficial it is for horses: ‘riding horses back to health’

12:49 - the connection between Alexandra & Anja’s training

13:28 - enter ‘Graya’

14:15 - enter ‘Blondie’

15:02 - Anja’s influence as part of my journey

16:43 - Alexandra & Feldenkrais also part of my journey

17:53 - What prompted Michaela’s Masters in Equine Science & research study in Crib-biting

20:17 - What is crib-biting

22:14 - What do we know about why crib-biting happens

27:03 - a key piece to understand about crib-biting

27:23 - what do we understand the physical effect to be on the horse & how do humans feel about it

31:15 - what made Michaela passionate about crib-biting & why research

32:54 - how do crib-biting ‘collars’ work

36:37 - a further management intervention humans take

38:28 - another impact that people dislike

39:21 - why a single-subject study design

47:13 - how did the research experiment begin: surveillance & data and what that revealed.

51:37 - the living situation of the study horse(s)

55:07 - narrowing in on Blondie - testing hypothesis of link to feeding & making an important discovery

58:35 - further testing to narrow down what is the main influence

1:02:04 - deciding on interventions & the main takeaway points from what’s been learnt already

1:03:27 - a constructional approach, how this differs from a Veterinary approach & what Blondie needs to learn

1:07:20 - changing the context & routine to create a training condition

1:09:14 - the context/environmental change

1:10:25 - being mindful of the human influence in the training condition & building the behaviour

1:14:03 - describing what it looked like

1:14:41 - teaching the focus on consumption & the importance of having experienced animal trainers involved in scientific experiments involving animals

1:19:32 - how the training progresses over time - shifting to the 2nd part of the study, the routine described & maintaining the behaviour with environmental changes

1:25:39 - the big spanner in the broder study works

1:29:16 - further discoveries when broadening the experiment due to a changed condition

1:30:38 - building a relationship beyond the cribbing project, the impact of Covid & prioritising welfare

1:34:29 - a drastic change of environment & the impact on the cribbing behaviour

1:40:45 - the desire for further research but the pressing need to write-up what’s been done already

1:44:05 - the challenge of bringing two sciences together

1:46:46 - Michaela’s top tips for those with a cribbing horse

1:48:41 - cribbing during training with positive reinforcement (R+)/clicker training

1:52:27 - podcast wrap-up & what’s on next week

Links from Michaela:

Our links mentioned this episode:

From Green to Growth: developing positive partnerships for the future
Book a discovery call for From Green to Growth (available when new intake dates are announced)
Sign-up to our email list
Abbey's Run Equestrian website
Abbey's Run Equestrian on Facebook

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. You can find out more about podcast support on offer via: Blissery.FM or email info@blissery.fm

S3 E3: Young & green horses

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 17 Oct 2023 19:00:00 +0000

Having young and or green horses is awesome. But also, it can be confusing and overwhelming. We hear conflicting information on young horses – that we shouldn’t start them under saddle too early because their bodies need to develop. But then we also hear that they need a job to do and we often see that in the busy, exploratory behaviour we see from them. For many people it’s a rock and a hard place and we too often end up with young horses started under saddle too soon because they need a job to do.

There are absolutely other things we can do with young horses to give their busy minds and bodies things to do that will be beneficial now and into the future.

-----------

I have been super interested in working with young horses since I was a teenager at riding school… so we’re talking for maybe the last 30 years. In this episode I chat about why I’m so passionate about working with young and/or green horses. So passionate that our first Abbey’s Run Equestrian program, From Green to Growth is targeted for that cohort of horses and their owners.

In this episode we discuss:

1:31 - episode introduction

2:32 - where my interest in working with young horses comes from & my journey

3:47 - the highs and lows of breeding

6:19 - how special working with youngsters is

5:56 - it can go wrong

7:58 - our current youngsters & where they’re at

10:50 - advocating for students starting with youngsters

11:27 - never assume with any new horse of any age or ‘experience’ level - treat all as blank slates

12:55 - there are lovely mature horses out there, there are always many shades of bay ;-)

13:47 - ‘From Green to Growth: developing positive partnerships for the future’ was a natural progression

14:29 - participant feedback

14:54 - next intake & all about the program

19:24 - podcast wrap-up & what’s on next episode

Our links mentioned this episode:

From Green to Growth: developing positive partnerships for the future
Book a discovery call for From Green to Growth (available when new intake dates are announced)
Sign-up to our email list
Abbey's Run Equestrian website
Abbey's Run Equestrian on Facebook

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. You can find out more about podcast support on offer via: Blissery.FM or email info@blissery.fm

S3 E2: The differences & similarities in training dogs and horses - with Hannah Branigan

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Hannah Branigan, Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 10 Oct 2023 19:00:00 +0000

I am ridiculously excited to have Hannah Branigan as our guest on An Equine Conversation this episode.

If you don’t know Hannah’s work, you should make a point of getting to know it. Hannah’s education programs and content in the animal training space with a focus on dogs is next level excellent. Her podcast, Drinking from the Toilet that I’ve mentioned a couple of times in the past on An Equine Conversation and have recommended to many people, is one of my favourites for insightful training information, looking at all the shades of grey in the training space and the best part is that it’s presented in a really authentic way. While Drinking from the Toilet has a dog focus, so much of the conversation directly relates to training horses & other species.

For a while now, I’ve wanted to do an episode on An Equine Conversation about the differences & similarities between training dogs and horses. I know the vast majority of horse people also have dogs. And I see regularly a really fascinating thing happen where people will train their dog with positive reinforcement, yet they don’t apply the same training approach with their horses. There seems to be a long-held belief in a large part of the horse-world that we can’t train horses with positive reinforcement, we can’t train them using food. That using food would be bribing them, will make them muggy, yet we’re often comfortable to train our dogs using food. FYI This isn’t the case – we can train horses using positive reinforcement and it’s super effective & people around the world are doing it with awesome success.

I wanted to unpack the differences but also the similarities between training dogs and horses. I’m a huge fan of Hannah’s and I know that Hannah is not only amazingly awesome in her work with dogs, she also has horses. I reckoned Hannah might be the perfect person to unpack this conversation with me.

I was beyond delighted when Hannah agreed to come and chat with us & I managed to restrain myself from fan-girling at her too much. We had a super interesting conversation where Hannah shared some of her lesser known story with horses.

It won’t surprise anyone who knows Hannah’s work to know that we got into some training weeds and a more in-depth but totally awesome conversation than maybe I had planned. …. A conversation which I’m so excited to share with you. Enjoy!

PS. We did have some technical issues with this recording. Thanks to Hannah for bearing with as we worked through them at the time and thanks to Matthew Bliss for working as much magic as possible to improve the sound quality.

Hannah Branigan:

Hannah Branigan, the author of Awesome Obedience, is a self-proclaimed training nerd. With the belief that everyone (dogs and humans alike) learn best in an environment free of criticism, Hannah breaks down complex skills into bite-sized, accessible pieces, and develops practical techniques that leave her students with a sense of achievement and success.

She is on a mission to make training fun and enjoyable for dogs and their handlers, which means optimizing positive reinforcement techniques across species. She is fascinated by behavior and learning, and passionate about bringing innovative, science-based solutions to the dog/human learning space.

Hannah has a background in both human sports and biology. Now she applies that knowledge and experience to the world of animal training and canine competitive sports. She enjoys training and competing with her own dogs in a variety of sports. Her competition obedience DVDs, Obedience FUNdamentals and Beyond FUNdamentals, have received rave reviews from trainers all over the world, and her students have earned advanced titles and in multiple countries.

Hannah is the host of the popular dog training podcast, Drinking from the Toilet, which focuses on the (often inconvenient) intersection between positive reinforcement philosophy and reality. Her mentorship program, Zero to CD, gives trainers a complete, step-by-step blueprint for earning their first level obedience title with curated support along the way.

In this episode we discuss:

1:31 - episode introduction

4:32 - introducing Hannah Branigan

6:20 - Hannah’s background with horses

10:28 - where did the dogs come into the story

14:32 - shifting career trajectory

15:16 - the current animal family

15:45 - the weird thing that is dog-owners seeming to know how to train by osmosis

16:46 - the dog chicken and horse egg - which comes first

17:51 - how we categorise horses through a different lens to dogs

19:41 - the biggest difference between the two species

24:02 - other differences: the rhythm of movement horses need versus dogs

26:51 - re-setting a dog in training versus a horse & different work arounds

30:02 - different ethology in how dogs & horses consume food (and humans too) & implications for training

36:42 - impact of the environment on our animals & our training

44:06 - switching from training horses with more conventional, pressure/release methods to R+

53:13 - onto the similarities between training dogs & horses using R+: the left and the right-hand sides

54:50 - discomfort of humans around working with reinforcers, the importance of training reinforcement procedures & predictability & certainty, and impact of balance on how we feed

1:02:46 - things taught the same way

1:09:35 - horses occupying a unique niche in the human mind & the impact of equestrian art on what we perceive as beautiful

1:13:32 - dogs & horses as inhibited species - process of domestication impacts

1:16:13 - top training tips: reinforcement drives behaviour so train reinforcement behaviours first & foremost

1:17:43 - next top tip: don’t think too hard on the ‘mistakes’ - get to reinforceable moments ASAP

1:19:17 - the little things: example of impact of reinforcement delivery

1:22:00 - the basement behaviours even before the reinforcement delivery & the impact of early learning history

1:24:43 - what’s coming up at Abbey’s Run Equestrian

1:27:14 - podcast wrap-up & what’s on next episode

Links from Hannah:

Our links mentioned this episode:

From Green to Growth: developing positive partnerships for the future
Book a discovery call for From Green to Growth (available when new intake dates are announced)
Sign-up to our email list
Abbey's Run Equestrian website
Abbey's Run Equestrian on Facebook

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. You can find out more about podcast support on offer via: Blissery.FM or email info@blissery.fm

S3 E1: Movin' to the country - with Benn Sheffield

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Benn Sheffield, Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 3 Oct 2023 19:00:00 +0000

This episode of An Equine Conversation is quite a different one:

In late 2015, Benn & I moved to the country, from the outer suburbs of Melbourne. Yep, we did eat a lot of peaches initially (we knew people with a prolifically producing tree), and have since planted 2 peach trees of our own LOL. For me, moving to the country had been a dream since I can remember (I can’t remember a time I didn’t want my own ‘farm’) and for Benn who grew up on a hobby-farm but then moved into town for study & work, returning to a more rural lifestyle was something he always intended to do. Here we are, almost 8 years on (sometimes it feels like 5 minutes, other times, forever) & while it’s an awful lot of work, for the most part, we absolutely love it.

Inspired by our friend and Podcast Producer Matthew Bliss & his wife Bernadine & their podcast ‘From My Home To Yours’, Benn (who had volunteered to come on a podcast episode) and I thought we’d take a moment to reflect on our experience of moving from one type of lifestyle to another. Something we haven’t really stopped to do like this since we moved almost 8 years ago now. It was an awesome opportunity to reflect on some of the challenges, some of the awesomeness & some of the differences we found in moving to the country, to live on our 40 acres. We thought you might enjoy listening in and sharing on our revisiting some of the most memorable changes.

Benn Sheffield:

Logistics and tech extraordinaire, things would grind to a stand-still at Abbey’s Run if it wasn’t for Benn and his breadth of skills. From fencing to fixing the tractor, tech support to website updates and video editing, Benn forms a vital part of the Abbey’s Run Team.

Benn grew up on a hobby farm in the Yarra Valley when the Valley was a quieter place than it is now - focused on sheep & cattle farming before becoming more trendy with the growth in the winery industry. Life on a hobby farm was in many ways idyllic: growing up with dogs around & regularly having orphan lambs or calves to raise and have around the place. Benn moved into town to study and while starting his career in the environmental field.

Benn was not horsie growing up & is one of those partners who is horsie by default now. He and Sarah found and moved to Abbey’s Run almost 8 years ago - getting Benn back out of town and into a country lifestyle, something he’d always felt he would do.

In this episode we discuss:

1:29 - episode introduction

3:42 - introducing Benn

4:18 - why move to the country

6:53 - what we were looking for & the process of finding our property

19:56 - some of the challenges we encountered when we first moved here

46:52 - some of the awesomeness we encountered when we first moved here

1:11:41 - differences we discovered in the local community culture

1:20:30 - differences in costs

1:25:05 - in summary

1:28:15 - podcast wrap-up & sneak-peek into what’s on next week

Our links mentioned this episode:

Reliable Recall Challenge (for horse & pony owners)
From Green to Growth: developing positive partnerships for the future
Book a discovery call for From Green to Growth (available when new intake dates are announced)
Sign-up to our email list
Abbey's Run Equestrian website
Abbey's Run Equestrian on Facebook

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. You can find out more about podcast support on offer via: Blissery.FM or email info@blissery.fm

S3: Trailer

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 26 Sep 2023 20:00:00 +0000

Hello lovely listener!
We are delighted to be back with Season 3 of An Equine Conversation, a podcast brought to you by Abbey’s Run Equestrian. I’m your host, Sarah Nickels.

Just like the previous Seasons, Season 3 includes 8 episodes (plus this trailer). Episodes will drop on a Wednesday morning, Melbourne/Sydney time. We’re dropping our first episode next Wednesday, October 4th.

Check out this trailer for a glimpse of what’s coming up this Season & to find out about the free challenge we have starting next week (October 5th) and our next intake of our young and/or green horse program, From Green to Growth: developing positive partnerships for the future.

Our links mentioned this trailer:

From Green to Growth: developing positive partnerships for the future

Book a discovery call for From Green to Growth (available when new intake dates are announced)

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. You can find out more about podcast support on offer via: Blissery.FM or email info@blissery.fm

S2 E8: The difficulty of language with Julia Inglis

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels, Julia Inglis) — Tue, 13 Jun 2023 20:00:00 +0000

I’m delighted to welcome our good friend, Julia Inglis back to An Equine Conversation. We first met Julia in Series 1, Episode 8 ‘Julia’s story - a tale to learn from’. If you want to hear Julia’s story, you can jump back and listen to that episode.

Julia & I talk so much about training, so we thought we’d start to share some of these conversations with you.

In this episode, we start by catching up on how Julia’s horse Maddy, who has Equine Metabolic Syndrome (EMS) went over last Spring and Summer. Then, we get into the weeds of talking about the challenges of the English langauge, particularly the use of labels, in the horse world…. but because this is Julia and I, we quickly end up down various rabbit holes due to what we’d both been seeing in the months before we spoke, including talking about what you do when you remove labels, the challenge of addressing the actual problem when that impacts your plans and what the movie ‘Frozen’ has to do with horses and training.

Julia Inglis:

Julia grew up in the UK and was animal mad from a young age, catching her first pet when a rabbit wandered into her garden. She learned to ride at school but stopped for many years when she went to university in Glasgow before moving to London for further studies. Julia completed her PhD in neuropharmacology in 2004 and went on to establish a research career in the area of pain mechanisms in arthritis.

After completing her studies Julia started riding again at a local riding school, and around this time she met her now husband at a conference. He lived in Perth, Australia and in a bid to persuade her to move there started sending adverts for horse properties and horses. Within months Julia moved to Australia and they bought their first horse, which soon became 2 then 3, and is now a small farm full of animals.

Julia rode traditionally for close to a decade, bush riding and dressage but when her horse refused to move under saddle ended up learning about alternative ways to train and positive reinforcement. This has now become her passion and obsession as it combines science and training geekery with animals - her two great loves.

In this episode we discuss:

1:39 - episode introduction

3:08 - an update on Maddy over last Spring & Summer (Julia’s horse with EMS)

12:26 - how we use language, labels & why they're problematic but also useful

26:35 - what you do when you unravel the label & then have to do something about what’s going on

38:04 - back to labels - 'boring'

41:21 - so what even is a 'bombproof' horse or pony & what the kids film ‘Frozen’ has to do with ‘bombproof’ horses

53:11 - where to now - body language again & building a common language & labels as short-hand

59:08 - summary & the need for a new shared language / labels in the horse world

1:02:33 - the influence of history & present art on what we label 'beautiful' & see as desirable

1:06:06 - top tips & then some

1:13:14 - important end-of-season announcements

Link from Julia:

While not mentioned in the podcast, Julia has requested we share the link for the Western Australia (WA) Equine Clicker Trainer group so that those in WA who are interested can join and share.

Our links mentioned this episode:

Free, thought-provoking resources on Erin’s website

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. You can find out more about podcast support on offer via: Blissery.FM or email info@blissery.fm

S2 E7: Advocating for your horse with Erin Moore

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Erin Moore, Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 6 Jun 2023 20:00:00 +0000

*Please note: this episode does contain profanity*

I first encountered Canadian-based Erin Moore when a friend pointed me to a podcast episode Erin had done last year on running a successful dog training business and I immediately resonated with Erin’s work. I loved what Erin was all about & since that time have been working with Erin on my business, Abbey’s Run Equestrian.

Cut to earlier this year & Erin was on the ‘Drinking from the Toilet’ podcast, which is a fabulous podcast about all things dog training that I highly recommend. It’s one of my favourite podcasts to listen to, with much of the content translating very directly to horses. On that episode, Erin was talking about advocating for your dog and it really struck me that this is content horsie folk needed to hear too. I know it’s something I could personally always get better at and in the past I’ve supported quite a number of my students in some of their advocacy options for their horses.

We can often think about advocacy as being confrontational, but it doesn’t have to be that. Sure, it is sometimes, but there are many other non-confrontational ways we can advocate for our loved horses and other equines too.

Erin Moore:

In this episode we discuss:

1:28 - profanity warning

1:53 - introduction to this episode topic & to Erin Moore

3:59 - Erin’s horsie past, career with dogs & what Erin does now

9:06 - what does advocating for our equine mean & advocating ‘quietly’

11:05 - a lived example from Abbey’s Run where advocacy in the moment was difficult (even with all my experience)

14:10 - the challenge in the moment, the impact of our history & what feeling shame does

15:55 - when it’s a ‘professional’, authority figure & gender dynamics & taking that all into account

19:17 - knowing how to research a trainer is not something most people know how to do

20:26 - the advocacy that is not working with someone that makes you feel bad & that doing things after the event is advocacy

22:34 - when an expert provides advice on something they’re not qualified or experienced to provide advice on, discerning what’s good information & what’s not - learning about that as advocacy

25:22 - avoiding a situation as advocacy - giving ourselves permission

29:48 - modelling & so normalising advocacy

32:06 - advocacy when it comes to competitions, particularly team events - which hard do you want

37:11 - an advocacy example from the past & being able to pivot

39:56 - training as advocacy & cooperative care in the horse world

43:57 - the wild that is that we see horses so differently to other species for cooperative care & where’s the horse world at with cooperative care - the impact of history

46:25 - keeping our practitioners safer, saving them time & keeping ourselves & our horses safer

47:11 - what even is cooperative care

50:01 - us doing our own therapy is part of advocating for our animals

51:07 - why should we advocate for our animals

52:37 - what you can do after this episode to better advocate for your equine

57:28 - building the skills to advocate our animals helps us advocate better for ourselves & focusing on little steps to build the big picture

1:00:32 - having other people support you in the advocacy where it’s difficult to have your own voice - planning with them ahead of time

1:06:29 - recognising the systemic issues that make it harder for certain groups of people to advocate

1:08:56 - advocating can be done many ways & we can develop our advocacy skills, thinking differently about advocacy opens up options

1:10:08 - quiet advocacy & making choices

1:11:30 - where to find more from Erin & a reminder that Erin is a business coach, not an equine instructor

1:14:28 - coming up next week

Link from Erin:

Our links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. You can find out more about podcast support on offer via: Blissery.FM or email info@blissery.fm

S2 E6: Set up for success: it takes a team

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels) — Wed, 31 May 2023 02:08:28 +0000

We want your training with your horse to be fun & enjoyable for your both – in short, we want you to be really successful in your training.

When we think about training with our horses & being successful with our training, we often think about the time when we're actively training 1:1 with our horse... but there is a whole bunch of stuff that comes before the active training part that is inextricably connected to how successful any active training will be or not.

Some of the things that come before take some time to put in place & others can be done more rapidly. The very cool thing too, is that the more we get in place and the more practiced we get at setting ourselves and our horses up for success, the faster it becomes over time. So while initially, it might take some conscious, focused thought and actions – it will become easier over time.

Setting ourselves up for success is something we will be exploring in greater detail with you awesome humans who get involved in our virtual young & green horse program that launches on the 1st of August 2023… but setting ourselves & our horses up for success is so important & we wanted to touch on it here, through An Equine Conversation too.

There is so much we could talk about on how we set ourselves and our horses up for success but today we’re going to follow on from something we mentioned super briefly in Series 2, Episode 3 of An Equine Conversation with Dr Lisa Walter – that it takes a team.

In this episode we discuss:

1:29 - episode introduction

3:01 - recap on the importance of ruling out pain for training success

5:10 - the team: who’s on it, ever-evolving & differences in support

9:16 - a closer look at the training impact of saddle fitting

14:38 - a closer look at the training impact of dental stuffs

18:29 - episode wrap-up

21:42 - what’s coming up next episode

Links mentioned this episode:

Horses and People - The 2020 Five Domains Model for Welfare Assessment

Equiculture - The 3 F’s. Why they are important to your horse

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. You can find out more about podcast support on offer via: Blissery.FM or email info@blissery.fm

S2 E5: The impact of periods on participation: a Pony Club Australia study

Tue, 23 May 2023 23:53:08 +0000

In early 2022, I started to become a more ardent feminist as I became increasingly exposed to staggering statistics and information around the gender inequality still facing women. This isn’t to say I was ignorant or not a feminist beforehand; it’s more that my focus has become even sharper the more I’ve been exposed to. I’m very grateful to the friends who introduced me to some excellent resources including: Annabel Crabb’s book ‘The Wife Drought’, ‘The Guilty Feminist’ podcast and book by Debra Frances-White, and the book ‘Rage Becomes her’ by Soraya Chemaly. This has coincided with my work with Erin Moore, a business coach who works with women, primarily dog trainers – and really addresses the mindset piece: unpacking the challenges women face in business and just where those challenges are coming from (which has been incredibly revealing as to why we women face some of the challenges we do in business, in the workforce and in life generally). It’s been an eye-opening time and I’m very thankful to have had this revelation about just how much I was accepting unquestioningly as a result of my own learning history & societal conditioning. I’ve no doubt my learning & understand has a long way to go still.

This exposure of mine has led to this podcast episode & this being something I believe we need to talk about & get the conversation happening around more widely.

Menstruation is something that almost all women experience. That is something like half the population of the world. Half. It is impactful but is something that has been quite taboo in many places & caused many women a great deal of anxiety, not to mention regular & debilitating pain in some cases.

Late last year I started to see various sporting codes starting to speak out around the impact of menstruation on women’s participation in sport with various pieces of research showing some very impactful results. One study in the UK showed that 42% of 14 – 16 year olds said their period stops them taking part in physical activity at school.

As a result, some groups around the world started to review their uniform or dress code for female players, where the historic uniform was white.

In November 2022, Wimbledon announced a historic change in their uniform rules after current and former players expressed the stress of having to wear all-white while having their period. Some female players had expressed they were using the contraceptive pill to change their menstruating cycle to make sure they didn’t have their period while playing at Wimbledon. The change now means women can wear coloured undershorts, with the Chief Executive of the All England Club expressing that the hope is that the new rule will help players focus purely on their performance by relieving a potential source of anxiety.

In December 2022, the Australian Football League, AFL, Womens division announced a historic uniform policy change with players no longer having to wear white shorts when playing in away games. With the decision, designed to reduce player anxiety around menstruation, coming after extensive consultation with clubs and players and research that found discomfort in uniforms to be a significant barrier for girls and women in pursuing sport at all levels.

In early 2023, women’s soccer teams in the UK and Ireland also started to move away from wearing white shorts for the same reasons as the AFL, with the England Women’s Football team new shorts even having leak protection built into them.

As a woman, the stress and anxiety that comes with having a period is not lost on me. For a very long time, women have had to suck it up & deal with it quietly. I’m no exception to that. I’ve been like these players & worried about leaking & if anyone is seeing it. I’ve been in the horse world for a long time and have had to contend with bathrooms at clubs with no sanitary disposal bins; had to jam sanitary products down my breeches because they don’t always have pockets & even if they did, being skin tight, it’s pretty evident when we have things in them; had to contend with no hot water at hand basins to wash with; worn jumpers tied around my waist just in case of leakage, and been concerned of anyone noticing. And that’s just the equine world. In my office job, I’ve actively worn dark coloured pants when menstruating, worn jumpers around my waist and even surreptitiously checked any chair I’ve sat on to make sure I didn’t leak onto it. I’m quite sure that you will have had your own experiences and ways of dealing with this yourself.

Half of the population have been having to contend with this type of thing for a really long time. Half. While the other, approximate half, have often been unaware that this is all going on for us (certainly this episode triggered some great discussions at home for us with Benn realising just how much stuff we women are contending with that he wasn’t acutely aware of).

While players in sporting activities have expressed anxiety over participation, and a concern around not being able to focus on being the best player they can be due to stress around their period – the way this translates to us working with horses is frankly terrifying, with the enormous risks that come with not being able to focus on the living, breathing, thinking animal you are beside or on top of.

So how do we empower those of us working with horses to be able to be present in the moment and focused on their horse instead of worrying if anyone is noticing if they have their period?

I was absolutely delighted when I saw in October 2022 that Pony Club Australia had partnered with researchers at the University of Newcastle and University of Western Australia to research the impact menstruation was having on Pony Club members and their participation. I wanted to know more about this research project and it’s outcomes, and moreover, I wanted to highlight this conversation, to raise it’s profile, to help normalise us talking about this, and so I invited Dr Catherine Ainsworth and Dr Kirrily Thompson to join us on An Equine Conversation. We also invited the Chief Instructor & Vice President of Yandina and District Pony Club in Queensland, Tarryn Jenkins, to give us the low-down on what’s happened at her club as a result of the research.

I am so very excited and frankly proud, to bring you this episode. I hope it helps you both personally as individuals and to have conversations around the impact of menstruation on us women & things we can do to reduce related stress & improve participation, with your connections in the equine world and beyond.

Dr Catherine Ainsworth:

Dr Catherine Ainsworth has undergraduate and postgraduate degrees in Veterinary Science. Her postgraduate study was in equine reproduction which led to many years in equine stud practice. With an interest in a corporate career, Catherine worked in the veterinary pharmaceutical industry in marketing and technical support roles and then agribusiness, whilst completing a MBA part time at the Melbourne Business School (University of Melbourne). Catherine went on to be the director of the Victorian state veterinary laboratory for 10 years, managing animal health diagnostics and research from 1999 – 2010. She then led the development of the new agricultural science centre in Victoria and investment programs in animal and plant biosecurity and biotechnology for 5 years. Catherine is a Graduate of the Australian Institute of Company Directors and the AICD Mastering the Boardroom program. Catherine has been CEO of Pony Club Australia since 2016 and has led the organisation through major initiatives with a sharp focus on connecting with and delivering benefits to club members.

Catherine is also the:

• Deputy Chair of Harness Racing Victoria and Chair of the Integrity Committee,

• Deputy Chair of Royal Agricultural Society of Victoria,

• Director of Racing Analytical Services, and

• Member of the Victorian Animal Welfare Advisory Council.

Like quite a number of us, Catherine comes from a non-horsey family and joined Narrandera Pony Club in NSW only after she could convince her father she could look after her horse herself.

Dr Kirrilly Thompson

Dr Kirrilly Thompson is a cultural anthropologist who has been researching and writing about human-horse relations for two decades.

In 2018 she published a book called ‘(Un)stable relations: Horses, humans and social agency’ co-authored with Professor Lynda Birke. She and Linda argue for the need to consider horses as active agents in their relationships with humans.

In addition to her research on horse welfare, Kirrilly has explored risk perception and safety behaviours of equestrians in contexts ranging from bullfighting from horseback in Spain, through showjumping in the United Kingdom and eventing in Australia.

She is currently a One Health research fellow at the University of Newcastle working in the Hunter New England Local Health District in a position funded by NSW Health on health protection, with a particular focus on the prevention of zoonotic diseases – diseases that spread from horses to humans such as ringworm, psittacosis and Hendra virus.

Kirrilly worked for Pony Club Australia for two years as the National Participation and Development Manager. She started her own life with horses at Pegasus Pony Club in South Australia and competes in dressage with her horse Mouse. Kirrilly is passionate about making horse-riding more enjoyable for horses and humans alike.

In this episode we discuss:

1:27 - introduction to today’s episode topic

8:23 - who are Dr Catherine Ainsworth & Dr Kirrilly Thompson

11:27 - what is Pony Club Australia & who’s involved?

14:06 - where did the study come from? Recognising periods as a barrier to participation & starting to consider the study focus area - the social taboo & the process of getting the survey ready

18:38 - why white or other light coloured jodhurs - where the history of light coloured pants for riding has come from?

21:38 - how was the proposed study received by the CEO of PCA? the need for evidence to build a case for change & elevating the voice of those impacted

23:25 - why 10 - 17 year olds? Getting the survey out there & the 2 broad types of responses (the good & the not so good)

29:18 - the type of questions asked, the broad responses participants contributed & the start of the statistics from the study

32:10 - guidelines/stipulations on provision of facilities & uniform - the impact of the study timing on the introduction of new National Rules for uniforms & gear

33:06 - more on the participation & feedback - the older age group wanted to be heard

34:47 - what change has happened for PCA as a result of the survey - the shift in National, jodhpur uniform guidelines

36:02 - survey responses around darker colour jodhpurs, the need for rule change AND cultural change (and what those cultural changes could be for clubs)

37:40 - club responses when the survey results were released, the priorities of PCA that guide decision-making: safety & welfare, the potential for pink polka dot jodhpurs & other options

40:10 - the un-related positives for wearing darker colour jodhpurs - ease of cleaning, body image, etc & the stories of the labour people have gone to, to maintain light-colours jodhpurs

43:31 - possible implications for people not joining Pony Club because of period impacts, or those that come once and don’t come back & research raising more questions

44:47 - some riders have support, but not all have support around them when attending Pony Club & the implications for managing period impacts

45:50 - More of the survey statistics: hot running water, sanitary disposal bins, the layout of clubs & difficulty of going to the toilet discreetly

48:05 - the many & varied implications for coaches - toilet breaks, riders not using a forward seat or pulling horses off jumps

50:35 - the huge safety implications of distraction/anxiety & not riding well due to concerns & the survey highlighting unexpected ie, important points around coaches needing to allow students ample time to visit the toilet, and the limitations of qualifying events for Regional riders

53:45 - coaches needing to put themselves in the shoes of the diverse groups they teach & PCA’s evolution to better support the diverse participants

57:08 - further research to explore, participation for confidence - the gateway to a social circle & social life & PCA Awards to reward non-competitive achievements

1:02:00 - hearing from Yandina & District Pony Club & the changes implemented as a result of the research & findings

1:09:47 - the reach of the study, how change can seem difficult but we’ve seen it to be possible, how quickly things can change & the importance of modelling behaviour

1:12:58 - the community as moderators for this work

1:14:08 - the statistics on: the impact on participation in rallies & competitions, the level of worry when wearing light-coloured jodhpurs and what the take-up in wearing dark-coloured jodhpurs would be

1:16:49 - would we lose anything by not wearing light-coloured riding pants & other ways to express respect

1:21:40 - a huge thanks to those who participated in the survey & the other researchers involved

1:23:33 - what’s coming up next episode

Links from Catherine & Kirrilly:

Pony Club Australia - Media Release 19/10/22 - Pony Club Australia listens to young members about the impact of periods on participation

Pony Club Australia

Pony Club Australia Facebook page

Yandina & District Pony Club

Horses and People: ‘Dressed for the Ride: The history of rider wear’

Our links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. You can find out more about podcast support on offer via: Blissery.FM or email info@blissery.fm

S2 E4: The 'truth' in buying a horse

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 16 May 2023 20:00:00 +0000

In my almost 3 decades of teaching people with horses, there are some things I have been asked about many times. Questions around or support in buying a new horse has been one of these.

Horse shopping, much like property shopping, can be an emotional roller-coaster of an experience. Then when you finally land on which equine and have your new partner home, things may not go, in fact often they don’t go, quite as you imagined they would.

In this episode I’m going to speak to the ‘truth’ in buying a horse, whether that be your first, second, third or tenth horse.

In this episode we discuss:

1:26 - episode introduction

2:08 - dishonest sellers as opposed to different ‘truths’

3:01 - where our truth comes from

3:28 - why the difference in the ‘truth’ & what it can look like

4:55 - the influential impact on the truth of the conditions the horse is kept in

5:54 - examples to highlight the impact of conditions on the ‘truth’

9:20 - a difference in a seller and buyers ‘truth’ about a horse & the importance of asking a seller but also observing the horse

10:46 - the use of descriptive labels & getting to the bottom of what they actually mean

11:46 - the exception to the rule where the ‘truths’ meet & the effort that went into setting up this mutual ‘truth’

13:45 - what to do now with this information

15:46 - intro to what’s coming up next episode

Our links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. You can find out more about podcast support on offer via: Blissery.FM or email info@blissery.fm

S2 E3: Why ruling out pain in horses is hard with Dr Lisa Walter

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Dr Lisa Walter, Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 9 May 2023 20:00:00 +0000

How many people do you know who’ve had some kind of pain or illness that the human medical professionals have not been able to get to the bottom of or provide relief from? Or where it’s taken some time and robust investigations, often driven by the person or their family to figure out what’s going on?

I know quite a few & have experienced this myself, and this is with the diagnostics available to human medicine.

Almost daily I see equine-owning humans asking for training help online with a horse that’s body language and behaviour is indicating likely pain. Sometimes this body language from the horse is fairly explicit and other times it’s more subtle. Some of the lovely humans asking for help have sought some veterinary intervention, but it can happen that their initial vet hasn’t been able to find anything wrong.

If you listened to Episode 8 in Season 1 of An Equine Conversation, Julia’s story with her horse Maddy, you’ll know that Maddy was exhibiting behaviour that indicated something was wrong and that Julia had to push past initial vet suggestions to get to the point of an actual diagnosis for what was wrong, and then how to treat and manage what was going on for him. It took some time and probing and pushing to figure it out.

And here’s the thing. Pain in horses is not always possible to rule out or resolve. It’s not a matter of just saying there’s nothing wrong – because there can be and the science and diagnostic equipment just isn’t there yet to figure absolutely everything out – but, the science, the technology and the research are making progress and there’s so much more available to us than 20 years ago.

I wanted to talk to an Equine Veterinarian about why it’s challenging to rule out pain in horses and what we can and should do about it as owners, so I asked my friend, Dr Lisa Walter, Equine Vet in South Australia, if she would join me for a chat. I always love speaking with Lisa as she has so much knowledge and a constant curiosity about how the horses body works – which has led her to working on a PhD in Sacroilliac dysfunction. I’m so pleased to bring this conversation to you and hope it helps expand your knowledge, awareness, understanding and ability to pursue niggles about any pain you are suspect of with your equines.

Dr Lisa Walter:

Lisa Walter is a veterinarian, researcher and educator with an interest in subtle lameness in sport horses, including the early identification and management of performance horses exhibiting low grade lameness, and locomotory dysfunctions. She completed her veterinary research training and veterinary degree at the University of Melbourne (1998, 2000) and has completed training in traditional Chinese medicine and acupuncture with the International Veterinary Acupuncture Society.

Her research includes the validation of a radiographic measurement technique used to identify early indicators of shinsoreness in Thoroughbred racehorses, clinical identification and management of sacroiliac dysfunction, and the effectiveness of different therapeutic modalities for musculoskeletal dysfunction in horses.

Lisa is based in Australia and has worked as a veterinarian in Australia and England in first opinion and referral equine practices. She currently runs her own integrative sport horse practice in the Adelaide Hills integrating veterinary medicine, acupuncture, physical therapy and therapeutic exercise to manage locomotory dysfunction in sport horses. She is a sessional lecturer for undergraduate and postgraduate veterinary courses across several universities, and is completing a PhD in sacroiliac dysfunction in horses at the University of Adelaide.

Outside of work, Lisa is a horse-owning tragic. She has trained and ridden horses across various disciplines including, showing, stockwork, eventing and showjumping. She loves working with the “project” horse and has an understanding and empathy for the challenges and rewards that this can bring.

In this episode we discuss:

2:26 - episode introduction

4:56 - introducing Dr Lisa Walter

6:41 - Lisa’s start & where she’s at now with her work and Equine Veterinary interests

9:16 - what brought Lisa to working on a PhD in sacroiliac dysfunction

12:08 - why is it so difficult to rule out pain in horses & the challenge of identifying indicators of pain in our horses

16:14 - the challenge of the Veterinary community of diagnosing more subtle conditions & the evolution of diagnostic/imaging equipment to better help diagnosis & having a non-verbal patient

18:00 - diagnostic imaging technology for equines

21:59 - Equine Veterinary Specialists

25:20 - why should we continue to try and rule out pain in our horses & not just a ‘naughty pony’

29:31 - the ‘cold backed’ horse

30:19 - pain versus dysfunction & the challenge for Veterinary medicine of understanding ‘normal variation’ with the developing imaging equipment

34:15 - how can individual owners contribute to further research in equine medicine?

37:00 - the evolution of physiological issues - awareness, diagnosis & changes in the equine population & equine management

39:55 - accessing Equine Specialists

43:56 - top tips for listeners - if you’re suspect your horse might be experiencing pain

45:51 - Vets who’ve done additional training in other physical modalities & the importance of having a trusted team of practitioners

48:46 - if you think there’s a problem - there generally is - trust your instinct

Link from this episode:

In this episode, Lisa mentions Dr Sue Dyson’s work on the ridden horse pain ethogram. If you haven’t yet watched already, check out:

‘The 24 Behaviors of the Ridden Horse in Pain: Shifting the Paradigm of How We See Lameness’ on YouTube to learn some about this research.

Our links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. You can find out more about podcast support on offer via: Blissery.FM or email info@blissery.fm

S2 E2: What's in a name... and a logo?

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 2 May 2023 20:00:00 +0000

We recently released our brand new and long-awaited logo for our business Abbey’s Run Equestrian. The bones of this logo have been rattling around my head for more than 2.5 years and we were finally in a position to bring it to life with the help of Evie Francesca Design Studio.

While the logo itself is physically 2-dimensional, each element holds a purpose or a story about our business, what we do and why we do it. This episode is to share with you the meaning behind each of the logo elements and what they mean for what we do here at Abbey’s Run Equestrian now and into the future.

In this episode we discuss:

2:15 - episode introduction

2:59 - why ‘Abbey’s Run Equestrian’ & who even is Abbey?

9:15 - tagline: ‘Teaching humans to teach horses’

11:36 - the human

12:46 - the horse

14:30 - the tree

15:20 - the colour & An Equine Conversation logo

Our links mentioned this episode:

Website: Megan Hines Equine

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. You can find out more about podcast support on offer via: Blissery.FM or email info@blissery.fm

S2 E1: A trainer, a donkey & a Golden Globe winning film - with Megan Hines

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Megan Hines, Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 25 Apr 2023 20:00:00 +0000

Late last year I started seeing promotions for the film The Banshees of Inisherin, an Irish film that included a miniature donkey Jenny as one of the stars alongside a cast of several other animals and the human actors including Kerry Condon, Colin Farrell and Brendan Gleeson. I’m not always a fan of animals in films but frankly, Jenny was just gorgeous and as my partner Benn is a fan of miniature donkeys, I was paying more attention.

I was so delighted to know that Jenny had been trained using positive reinforcement. Not only that, but she had been trained by someone I’d heard of for some years, Megan Hines. Working on a major motion picture with some big-name stars and experienced crew is not something many of us have exposure to, let alone training an equine using positive reinforcement to exist and perform in that environment. I was really keen to meet Megan, hear her training journey and learn about the experience on the film with Jenny… and to be able to share that conversation with you, so I invited Megan to join us for an episode of An Equine Conversation.

The Banshees of Inisherin was Directed by Martin McDonagh & released here in late December 2022. It has since won 8 Golden Globes, where Colin Farrell thanked Jenny in his acceptance speech, and was nominated for 9 Oscars. If you’ve yet to see it, do make sure to have your hanky ready!

Megan Hines:

Megan Hines is a gentle equine trainer and coach based in County Roscommon, Ireland.

Megan specialises in helping leisure horse owners and those with fearful equines to learn an equine-led approach that builds trust, motivates and brings out the character of your equine.

A South African by birth, Megan was taught by South African National Equestrian Federation instructors for 10 years, where she had the opportunity to experience and compete in a variety of equestrian disciplines including vaulting, gymkhana, dressage, show jumping and cross country.

Now, with over 20 years’ experience training animals with positive reinforcement (the use of rewards to motivate and shape behaviour), she is no longer competitive and is instead passionate about building a trusting human-equine relationship, avoiding stress and fear in daily handling and training, and teaching cooperative care.

Megan continues to further her professional development in the areas of equine behaviour and training through study with internationally recognised equine/mixed species positive reinforcement trainers and behaviourists. Her latest training achievements include the training and handling of Jenny donkey for the acclaimed Banshees of Inisherin.

Megan offers equine training and coaching, allowing you to learn the art and science of positive horsemanship: holistic horse management to best meet equine needs; true liberty work; cooperative care to problem solve for the vet, trimmer and for general handling; bring out the potential of fearful equines; ultimately enjoying a better relationship with your horse, pony, mule or donkey.

In this episode we discuss:

3:35 - introducing Megan

5:49 - Megan’s equine learning & training journey

11:04 - moving into volunteering with rescue horses & learning online

13:46 - the natural horsemanship phase

14:42 - moving out the other side toward training more with positive reinforcement

16:04 - the importance of looking at the animal in front of you

17:30 - becoming a Connection Training coach

19:00 - shifting to look at holistic needs of the animals

20:55 - equines learning from watching other equines learning & how that impacts float/trailer load training

26:17 - more on Megan’s equines, on working with rescue mules, donkey’s & working with livery horses

35:30 - on training the livery foal

42:02 - how Megan came to be training Jenny the donkey for The Banshees of Inisherin

46:00 - the lead time for training before filming began & what Jenny needed to learn

47:37 - how training for film relates to training our own horses for complex & stimulating environments

51:12 - and onward to shooting & working with the cast & crew

55:06 - scene takes & keeping Jenny interested

57:06 - verbal cues, visual cues or both

59:27 - working with the actors & Jenny

1:02:32 - more on the parallels with training for film & ‘normal’ horsie life & the importance of a good relationship & time

1:07:08 - where Jenny’s at now

1:08:40 - Megan’s coaching services, locally & virtually world-wide

1:11:07 - how online coaching compares to in person for Megan

1:14:00 - Megan’s top tips for you, our listeners, that you can go and do now

Links from Megan:

Facebook: Megan Hines - Positive Equine Training Ireland

Instagram: Megan Hines Equine

Our links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. You can find out more about podcast support on offer via: Blissery.FM or email info@blissery.fm

S2: Trailer

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 18 Apr 2023 20:00:00 +0000

We are super excited to be back with Season 2 of An Equine Conversation. Check out the trailer for a glimpse of Episode 1 & some fun training action we’ve got going on.

As with Season 1, Season 2 episodes will drop on a Wednesday morning, Melbourne/Sydney time. The season consists of 8 episodes (episodes we are so excited about bringing to your ears) plus this trailer. Episode 1 will be released on Wednesday, April 26.

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. You can find out more about podcast support on offer via: Blissery.FM or email info@blissery.fm

S1 E8: Julia’s Story - A Tale to Learn From

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Julia Inglis, Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 24 Jan 2023 19:00:00 +0000

In today’s episode, I’m speaking with Julia Inglis, a very good friend of mine who I met virtually through a mutual friend. Julia lives over in Western Australia, the other side of the country from me, and we’re actually yet to meet in real life. Julia and I are messaging one another and sometimes talking, almost daily about horse training and management. While we had so much we talked about discussing on this episode, we decided that actually the best place to start, was with Julia’s story – or at least some of. It’s a story that there is a lot to learn from - both in the way of managing horses (particularly those with Equine Metabolic Syndrome (EMS) and ulcers) and in the way of training approaches.

So now, let me introduce you to my good friend, Julia:

Julia Inglis:

In this episode we discuss:

5:00 - Julia's formative years with horses

8:30 - coming to Australia (from the UK), starting with horses here & the steep learning curve when you realise how much you don’t know

12:41 - the current set-up & animal collective

16:01 - Julia’s learning journey with horses & evolution since becoming a horse-owner. Recognising there was more to learn about riding

19:40 - the start of the challenges with Maddy’s health & training

22:39 - Maddy’s health problems become more evident

24:34 - needing to look beyond what you know

26:12 - the impact of Maddy’s ulcers & laminitis on transitioning to training using positive reinforcement

27:08 - full introduction to Maddy

32:02 - managing Maddy with ulcers, laminitis & EMS - the juggle and progression of management

41:07 - Julia’s training journey & shift in training approach to positive reinforcement (R+), also known as ‘clicker training’

47:26 - the influence of health on behaviour

49:17 - introducing Neo & his journey

53:03 - where Julia’s at with training with R+ now

55:04 - training with Ori (the dog) and other animals with R+ as well as the horses & the availability of learning with R+ with a dog

1:00:04 - the virtual/online training experience & the benefits

1:05:14 - top tips for you: understanding your horse, if your horses behaviour changes - get a vet, don’t keep doing the same thing that’s not going well & expecting different results - get expert help, don’t withhold food

1:09:36 - important end-of-series announcements

Link from Julia:

While not mentioned in the podcast, Julia has requested we share the link for the Western Australia (WA) Equine Clicker Trainer group so that those in WA who are interested can join and share.

Our links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. You can find out more about podcast support on offer via: Blissery.FM or email info@blissery.fm

S1 E7: What IS training with positive reinforcement?

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 17 Jan 2023 19:00:00 +0000

In the previous podcast episode with Sara Jackson, and in the next episode with Julia Inglis, you’ll hear mention of ‘positive reinforcement’ as a training approach. We’ve mentioned it ourselves too in talking about our Start Your Engines course+workshop.

I suspect that some of you listening will be well familiar with training using positive reinforcement, but there are likely others listening who are not so sure. So in this episode, we’re going to touch on what training with positive reinforcement, often abbreviated as R+, actually is.

We are not positive reinforcement purists at Abbey’s Run Equestrian, but training with positive reinforcement has become our primary and preferred approach to training anything with our horses here.

This was a big switch for me, as I grew up learning and then for many years also teaching, a more conventional approach to training with horses. It was some 8 years ago that I started to change my approach, initially as I had run out of other options with a challenging horse. Since then, I have continued to learn more and more about this training approach, the body of scientific research that sits behind it, and have been thoroughly exploring it with my horses, and absolutely loving the approach, the ethos and the results. Never have I had so much consistent fun with my training.

You’ll hear us talking quite a bit about positive reinforcement and all the connected bits and pieces through our podcasts to help share this fun and result producing training approach with you.

In this episode I discuss:

a working definition of the words ‘positive’ and ‘reinforcement’ in a training/learning context and what it means when we bring them together
who decides what’s pleasant (the added thing), why context matters and so the importance of having options
broad types of positive reinforcers (the something pleasant)
the need to provide the positive reinforcement immediately after the desired behaviour
the potential to strengthen unwanted behaviours if we reinforce them
a reminder of why we need to observe & interpret equine body language
the importance of choice in training with positive reinforcement
what you can do to start your positive reinforcement training journey right now

Our links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. You can find out more about podcast support on offer via: Blissery.FM or email info@blissery.fm

S1 E6: A journey to speaking horse with Sara Jackson

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sara Jackson, Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 10 Jan 2023 19:00:00 +0000

In this episode, I’m speaking with Sara Jackson who is across the other side of the Country from me, over in Western Australia. For those unfamiliar with Australia, that’s a 4-hour flight, plus the drive at each end to the airport, which at my end is over 3 hours.

We’re speaking about Sara's her own, quite colourful journey with horses and how this has brought her to sharing with other people about equine body language, equine behaviour & how important understanding this is for having a 2-way conversation with our horses and improving our relationship with them. Sara helps others learn more about equine behaviour and body language through her business Equestrian Balance and the Learn to Speak Horse Online Program.

Important note on this episode:

Please do note that Sara has experienced a couple of quite impactful, scary incidents with her horses that are discussed as part of this conversation. While these incidents are inextricably connected to the direction Sara has taken with her own horses and what she shares with others, some listeners may find the recounting of the stories upsetting. Please take care of yourself and stop listening if it gets too much for you.

Sara Jackson:

Sara Jackson is a coach for people who feel something is missing in their relationship with their horse. Helping them to move from longing for a remarkable relationship with their horse, to actually having a deep connection and understanding.

She does this by showing people how to understand their horses body language and how to respond in a way that enables them to have a conversation. It is these conversations, which open the door for the horses’ voice to be heard, which can utterly transform a horse-human relationship.

With qualifications in Equine Behaviour, Science and Teaching, Sara is well placed to share her knowledge. She is skilled at simplifying important concepts and presenting them in ways that are easy to understand and relate to.

Sara is a member of both the International Association of Animal Behaviour Consultants and the Pet Professional Guild of Australia.

Sara lives in the beautiful South-West of Western Australia with her partner and their young son, and has the luxury (and labour!) of having her 3 horses at home.

In this episode we discuss:

5:00 - Sara's formative years with horses

10:03 - the first turning point that influences Sara's journey

14:17 - the second turning point

21:04 - the third turning point

31:17 - equine behaviour & body language comes to the fore

38:26 - about the 'Learn to Speak Horse' program

45:24 - top tips for you the listener & what you can do to improve your understanding of equine behaviour & body language

Links referenced by Sara:

Website: www.equestrianbalance.com.au

Free resource: www.equestrianbalance.com.au/love

Facebook: www.facebook.com/EquestrianBalancePerth

Our links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. You can find out more about podcast support on offer via: Blissery.FM or email info@blissery.fm.

S1 E5: But it says ‘horse’ on the label…

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 3 Jan 2023 19:00:00 +0000

It is so easy to fall into the trap of assuming that because it says horse on the label, or comes from a saddlery, or produce store, that your horse will know what to do with, whatever the thing is. Especially if you believe that your horse had some life experience before it came to be with you.

This episode could be a super short one, where I just tell you that your horse DID NOT get the memo that they are supposed to know about things we humans have created for them, and that for all the things, to get a reliable response from the horse we need to go through a training process.

Cool, now you know what to do right? Shorted podcast episode in history… just joking, we’ll unpack this some more.

In this episode I discuss:

the common pitfall of assuming your horse knows what to do
examples of where it’s easy to assume our horses just know
the need for a training process
why a training process done by someone else (ie, previous owner or a trainer) won’t necessarily translate across to you
what to do right now about it

Our links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. You can find out more about podcast support on offer via: Blissery.FM or email info@blissery.fm

S1 E4: Preparing for Bushfires as a Horse Owner with Sharon Merritt

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sharon Merritt, Sarah Nickels) — Wed, 28 Dec 2022 01:39:53 +0000

In this week’s episode, I chat with Sharon Merritt from Victoria’s Country Fire Authority, better known here as the CFA, on preparing for bushfire (or you might know it as wildfire events) when we own horses. This is something we feel strongly about having had friends and family impacted in some of the more recent major fire events in our Country and having had fire come close to where our horses live a number of times. While we had a very wet Spring in our part of the world, fires still happen, and all the vegetation growth brought on by the rain will be creating fuel load for future fires. Join us for invaluable information and actions to implement that we all need to be aware of and implement for our own and our horses safety.

Important notes on this episode:

This episode talks about preparing for fire when you own horses. While this is a hugely important topic and one that all horse owners need to be aware of, there may be material covered in this episode that is triggering, particularly for those who have been involved in past fire events. You are very important. Please take care of yourself and skip this episode if it’s too much for you.
The recommendations contained in this episode are not the be-all and end-all of preparedness information. We are making recommendations based on past knowledge and experience however this will not cover every situation and every eventuality. Do not constrain your actions to what is mentioned in this podcast. Do your own research and work with your own local authorities to develop fire and emergency plans that are relevant to your situation.
You may be wondering why we’re putting this episode out of the back of the La Nina wet season and floods we’ve had in Victoria and NSW here in Australia. While it’s so far shaping up to be a quieter Summer due to the weather, there will still be fires in the landscape. And, all this amazing grass and other vegetation growth that’s happened with the wet, will be creating even more fuel for future fires. The time to prepare for fires is when it is wet and cold – not when the hot and dry weather hits, or a fire is approaching. So please, take the time afforded to us by the wetter season and get your fire preparation happening in a big way.

Sharon Merritt:

Sharon has been a horse owner for over 60 years, moving through Pony Club, then Adult Riding Club and spent many years competing in various disciplines. With a horsie family, Sharon taught at Pony Club for many years and is currently the owner of a couple of older horses and a colt that she is starting.

Sharon has been a CFA firefighter for 26 years, having been on the front line of fires, been in charge of crews, been the Incident Controller and been part of an Incident Management Team in most states of Australia and overseas. Sharon has spent many weeks at large fires including the Black Saturday fires in Victoria and the more recent 2019/2020 in Victoria and NSW.

Sharon is involved in Technical Large Animal Rescue, which involves rescuing horses, cattle and other livestock when they become trapped in dams, creek, horse floats in car accidents, septic tanks etc.

In this episode we discuss:

2:21 - Important information before listening to this episode

4:13 - Introducing Sharon Merritt

5:29 - What is the Country Fire Authority (CFA) & what does it do

6:49 - Why is it important to prepare for fire events as horse owners and carers

8:50 - How can we prepare as horse owners and carers?

The need for multiple fire plans that work in different scenarios

10:31 - Importance of leaving early

Preparing for leaving early and organising the destination you’re going to ahead of time

11:51 - The need for Plan B & setting your horse up in the safest way possible

13:39 - The paddock you want ready for your horse(s) to be in during days where fire is possible

14:56 - Not restraining a horse in enclosed, indoor spaces during fire events

15:15 - What horses will tend to do when fire is coming

15:54 - Open internal gates, NOT external gates

16:54 - Alternatives to an eaten-out paddock

17:24 - What else we can do to prepare our properties

18:04 - Context of Black Saturday impact

The need to have a good water source that can sustain a fire moving through

19:33 - If your plan is to leave early but you have more horses than you can transport at once

20:20 - Alternatives to horses eating out a paddock

21:35 - Radiant heat & awareness of nearby forest

Importance of having vegetation/trees around for our horses

24:41 - Identifying your horse

25:22 - What to protect besides our horses

26:43 - Impact of road-blocks to accessing your horse/property

28:03 - Get a Property Identification Code (PIC) or similar through Department of Agriculture

29:27 - Fire truck access & availability

30:17 - Considerations after the fire front has passed, ie. laminitis risk, tree roots burning

Checking for contamination of water supply from fire-fighting materials

Emergency temporary fencing

First Aid materials

33:09 - Example of when we enacted our Fire Plan at Abbey’s Run in 2019/2020 fires

37:44 - The risks of shifting horses location without planning for it ahead of time

Expectation from many public safe places to stay with horses, not leave them

Challenge of float-loading horses when stressed and in a hurry

39:52 - Risks with powerlines down - blocks and electrocution risk

41:11 - The impact of shifting fire-fronts & new fires to where it is safe to relocate your horse

41:53 - Horses ability to negotiate fire when set up well

43:18 - Importance of training with our horses for our fire plans

46:25 - Horses behaviour during fires

47:27 - Avoiding putting humans at risk

48:16 - The need to help for a long-time after fires

49:50 - Top tips & what you can do right now

52:26 - Connect with your local CFA or relevant authority & attend pre-season briefings or information sessions to learn more local information

Links referenced by Sharon:

Country Fire Authority - Horses and Bushfires information: https://www.cfa.vic.gov.au/plan-prepare/how-to-prepare-your-property/farms/horses-and-bushfires

Department of Agriculture Victoria - Property Identification Code information and applications: https://agriculture.vic.gov.au/farm-management/property-identification-codes

Department of Agriculture Victoria - Horses and Bushfire information: https://agriculture.vic.gov.au/livestock-and-animals/horses/health-and-welfare/assessing-horses-after-bushfires/horses-and-bushfire

Our links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. You can find out more about podcast support on offer via: Blissery.FM or email info@blissery.fm

S1 E3: Getting Your Ducks in a Row

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 20 Dec 2022 19:00:00 +0000

I’m not sure about you, but I’m pretty sure that more often than not, my horsie ducks have waddled off to a rave party, even with my horses that have been with me for many years.

In fact, I’d go so far as to say it’s rare that my ducks are in a row – in the row I actually want them in. Sometimes they’re in a row in aisle 3, except I’m in aisle 5 and wanting them there.

This can be a frustrating experience, having our horsie ducks waddling off. It can feel like we’re taking 3 steps forward then 2 steps back.

In this episode, we’re going to discuss why getting our horsie ducks in a row is a challenge, acknowledging that this is happening for us all, and look at what we can do about it.

Our links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. You can find out more about podcast support on offer via: Blissery.FM or email info@blissery.fm

S1 E2: Talking Emergency Response & First Aid with Dr Lizzie McCready

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Dr Lizzie McCready, Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 13 Dec 2022 19:00:00 +0000

In this episode I’m talking with Dr Lizzie McCready who has taken her profession from on the road Equine Veterinary practice to working with horse owners to improve their emergency response skills. Find out some top tips to improve your own skills & be better prepared for those inevitable emergencies that arise when we have horses.

Dr Lizzie McCready:

Dr Lizzie, an equine vet based in Melbourne is bringing invaluable vet-taught education to the horse owner world. She started Empowering Equine Education in 2021 after seeing first-hand how the majority of horse owners are poorly prepared to take action and care for their horses when an emergency strikes. Drawing from her veterinary experience she has developed The Equine Emergency Response Training to help equip owners with the knowledge and hands-on skills to feel confident and competent in dealing with any emergency they encounter. Her mission is to raise the current standard of horsecare owners can provide and pass on her valuable veterinary expertise to passionate horse people.
Qualifications: Bachelor of Veterinary Medicine (with Honours) from the Royal Veterinary College

In this episode we discuss:

2:05 - The discussion begins with a look back at Lizzie’s journey to get to where she is now.

12:24 - Emergency situations horse owners/carers can be better prepared for and why being better prepared can impact outcomes.

16:58 - Essential equipment for a First Aid kid.

21:46 - Emergency response training for horse owners/carers.

36:18 - The future of First Aid for horses.

37:18 - What you as listeners can go and do right now, in the next day or so.

Links mentioned by Dr Lizzie for Empowering Equine Education:

FACEBOOK: https://www.facebook.com/empoweringequineeducation

INSTAGRAM: https://www.instagram.com/empowering.equine.education/

JOIN THE HORSE HEALTH HUB FACEBOOK GROUP: https://www.facebook.com/groups/thehorsehealthhub

LEARN MORE ABOUT THE EQUINE EMERGENCY RESPONSE TRAINING: https://equineemergencyresponsetraining.com/2022

Our links mentioned this episode:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. You can find out more about podcast support on offer via: Blissery.FM or email info@blissery.fm

S1 E1: When Your Horse Says ‘No’

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 6 Dec 2022 19:00:00 +0000

The prevailing dogma for humans working with horses for 1000’s of years has been that the horse is there to serve us and fulfil our needs – from horses going into battle, to ploughing the fields, pulling the cart and working in mines. Despite the industrialisation of the Western World to a place where horses are now not so much a necessity as a luxury, a fun hobby, and us knowing that they are a sentient being, the dogma of the horse being there to serve us and fulfil our needs has, in a large part, continued.

So then, why should we now start to listen instead of pushing through when the horse says ‘no’?

In this episode we’re going to explore why it’s okay that our horses say no, how our horses are saying ‘no’, why we should listen to and respect the ‘no’ and what to do when the horse says ‘no’. We’ll also touch on when it’s okay to override the no.

Links:

Thank you to Matthew Bliss for podcast production & consultation. You can find out more about podcast support on offer via: MBPod.com or email him at business@mbpod.com.

An Equine Conversation (TRAILER)

info@abbeysrunequestrian.com.au (Sarah Nickels) — Tue, 6 Dec 2022 09:06:20 +0000

This podcast aims to help you, the horse owner, improve your knowledge by giving you access to top quality information that will help you be the best horse owner you can be so that you can give your horses the best life possible.

Through An Equine Conversation, I’ll share my expertise with you along with helping you connect to and hear from some amazing experts in their own fields – because while I have a lot of knowledge, I am by no means the expert in all of the things. We’ll also be talking with horse owners about their journey with their animals.

We’ll explore ways our horses can be physically and mentally healthier through topics around training, horse-health, enrichment, emergency preparedness, history, our own mental wellbeing and physical health and more. We’ll be giving you practical actions you can implement with your horses and information to explore, consider and further investigate.

These podcast episodes are absolutely designed to be thought-provoking and they may bring you some ideas, approaches or information that you haven’t come across previously.

Links: