Check out Tracey's resources: https://whitecloudrecruitment.com.au/news-articles/

Ways to standout in a crowded market: https://aclinstitute.com/newsroom/best-change-management-courses-australia/

Change Curiosity Lab https://www.changecuriositylab.com/

Working Out Loud with AI: Building Agile Change Momentum -Webinar  https://www.eventbrite.com/e/working-out-loud-with-ai-building-agile-change-momentum-tickets-1975063505111?aff=oddtdtcreator

Sue's Linkedin profile 

The shift from waterfall to moments-that-matter in M&A

Cultural due diligence as a critical success factor

Using agile planning in uncertainty

Building trust through iterative communication

Middle manager capability as a game-changer

Top 3 agile tools for M&A

If you’re a change practitioner working on or preparing for M&A—this episode is gold.

🎤 Featuring: Amy Leighton, Enterprise Change Partner at Aurecon
📄 Based on: ACMP’s May 2025 White Paper, Navigating the Future of Change Management

Global Connect - ACMP July conference 

https://www.coffeewithfleurpodcast.au/

The cardboard city

https://www.linkedin.com/posts/arnolddj_changemanagement-innovation-artsandculture-

activity-6976311483651559424-

1Mt1?utm_source=share&utm_medium=member_desktop&rcm=ACoAAAA0rqAB367qpi99p

2XAhEXan7UaipVDapc

https://captur3d.io/view/evolve-home-land/evolve-home-land

🔗 Learn more: epilepsyproject.org.au

https://www.brynnshader.com/

Disrupt HR in Denver Talk 

Lena's LinkedIn Profile 

Candace Trapp on LinkedIn 

Brain-Friendly Change:

• Designing change experiences that work by leveraging applied neuroscience.
• The importance of moving from fear to flow to overcome change resistance and failure.
• How brain-friendly change can serve as a protective shield against change overwhelm and fatigue.

Understanding Resistance:

• Redefining resistance as a natural response and exploring its neurological basis.
• Strategies for creating approach states and minimizing avoid states to foster engagement.

Leadership and Change:

• The critical role of leaders in setting the tone for change and the impact of their behavior on organizational culture.
• Practical tips for engaging leaders and aligning them with brain-friendly change practices.

Agile and Brain-Friendly Change:

• The synergy between agile methodologies and brain-friendly change.
• How agile practices support continuous learning, collaboration, and psychological safety.

Real-World Applications:

• Michelle shares real-life examples of implementing brain-friendly change techniques in large organizations.
• The significance of co-designing change initiatives with stakeholders to ensure success.

Throughout the episode, Michelle emphasizes the importance of continuous learning and adapting change practices to align with our understanding of human behavior and neuroscience.  updates.

Michelle Teunis on LinkedIn  (Guest) 

Lena Ross on LinkedIn (Host) 

Collabwise

Enroll in Brain-Friendly Change course. 

1. Agile Change Leadership: Exploring the role of agile change leadership in modern organizations.
2. World Agility Forum Highlights: Discussing key insights and takeaways from the World Agility Forum conference in Lisbon.
3. Challenges in Agile Adoption: Addressing common challenges and misconceptions in adopting agile methodologies.
4. Agile vs. Waterfall: Contrasting agile approaches with traditional waterfall methodologies in change management.
5. The Future of Change Management: Considering the evolving landscape of change management and the need for practitioners to adapt to new methodologies and tools.

Natasha on LinkedIn 

Casa de Cambio website

Natasha's podcast Casa de Cambio 

Aurecon's Digital Decision's report 

Aurecon Twitter 

Aurecon Facebook 

Aurecon Linkedin 

Aurecon Instagram 

Website - Advancing Women in Business & Sport 

Linkedin profile: Michelle Redfern 

Twitter: 

Facebook 

A career that soars 

https://weneedsocial.com/

@changingview on Twitter

https://antacarafrontiers.com/

https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/learning-out-loud-up-against-my-limits-triple-threat-dr-jen-frahm/

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/feb/16/white-fragility-racism-interview-robin-diangelo

http://laylafsaad.com/meandwhitesupremacy

Tim Rayner - @timrayner01 (twitter) 

https://www.hacker-culture.com/

LinkedIn 

Hayley Lewis @haypsych

https://halopsychology.com/

LinkedIn 

Melissa Dark  @melissadark

https://commonplacecommunication.com/

https://bustingsilos.com.au/

LinkedIn 

We cover:

Liam's pathway in to coaching

How leaders should use coaches

How agile coaches and change management practitioners work together 

What surprises Liam about coaching after all these years

What Liam wishes leaders would know or do

Liam's take on curiosity, empathy, vulnerability, courage and self-compassion 

https://www.patreon.com/drjenfrahm

https://agilechangeinstitute.com.au/agile-change-leadership-certificate/

https://bustingsilos.com.au/

http://www.talkingabout.com.au/3ControlInfluenceConcern

The Brene Brown podcast with David Kessler 

https://brenebrown.com/podcast/david-kessler-and-brene-on-grief-and-finding-meaning/

The 3.5% rule - social contagion 

https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20190513-it-only-takes-35-of-people-to-change-the-world

Post traumatic growth 

https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/beautiful-minds/post-traumatic-growth-finding-meaning-and-creativity-in-adversity/

My patreon page 

https://www.patreon.com/drjenfrahm

nts/learningdevelopment/the_change_curve.pdf

On why I do use the Kubler Ross Change Curve 

https://conversationsofchange.com.au/of-myth-busting-babies-and-bathwater/

Support the content I create 

https://www.patreon.com/join/drjenfrahm

The 4 Rs of future of work 

https://drjenfrahm.com/future-work/

The podcast where I worked out I wasn't as chilled as I thought I was :-/

https://brenebrown.com/podcast/brene-on-anxiety-calm-over-under-functioning/

9 week e-course 

https://bustingsilos.com.au/

Agile Change Leadership Certificate 

https://agilechangeinstitute.com.au/agile-change-leadership-certificate/

Compassion v empathy 

https://chopra.com/articles/whats-the-difference-between-empathy-sympathy-and-compassion

Become a patron!

https://www.patreon.com/join/4156152?

Panel discussion with Kristin Neff and Christopher Germer on the difference 

http://cultureofempathy.com/Projects/Conference/Panels/026-A.htm

Introduction to validity (for the nerdy ones) 

https://conjointly.com/kb/introduction-to-validity/

Original story of the Burning Platform 

Examples of business's / organisations 'running from pain' 

Pure Physio 

Virtual consults & home visits

Brisbane Run Squad - Free inspo program 

Hatch Exchange - Corona Virus Labour Exchange 

Art2biz.info - Jonathan Champ's idea on connecting out of work performing artists with corporate 

Happiness is contagious 

My talk on creating calm 

https://www.patreon.com/drjenfrahm

The blog post that has struck a chord

https://drjenfrahm.com/leading-uncertain-times/

Cameron Schwab creates courageous, confident and creative leaders. He’s also kind of Aussie Footy Royalty. The youngest CEO of a club in AFL history, and the continued success and failure for the next 25 years over three more clubs. He has stories to tell, and he knows his way about change and transformation. 

We talk change leadership in this conversation of change, but perhaps not what you would expect. Rich stories of learning, resilience, performance, authenticity, vulnerability and GFS. 

You’ll probably want more from Cam and you can find it at https://www.designceo.com.au/

If you want a signed copy, head to conversationsofchange.com.au/book or if that's not important you can find it on [Amazon!][2] in both kindle and paperback.

The book covers:

Structured in three easy to read parts.

Part 1: Shaping up - the decisions you need to make

• Clarity on 4 universal points of confusion in change
• Who’s who in the zoo! Easy to understand explanations of 10 necessary roles in change
• Change success – a three legged stool, pull one element away and it falls over
• 6 most commonly used change models explained

Part 2 Moving forward – the 5 pillars of change success

• 6 elements of change capable organisation
• Change readiness and how to assess if you are ready for change
• Dealing with change resistance – three key considerations
• From the trenches - 5 pitfalls of change communication to avoid
• 12 truisms of change leadership

Part 3 Check the peripherals – things that you should be aware of

• 5 Future of Work practices and how they can be used in your change efforts
• 6 myths of change management that can get in the way
• The ultimate information on how to develop your knowledge in change management – including associations, formal knowledge, communities of practice, self study with 11 change experts to follow on twitter and 17 change management blogs to bookmark

Bonus chapter! A full summary of all four adventures

[2]: https://www.amazon.com/Conversations-Change-Guide-Implementing-Workplace/dp/0648087921/ref=sr_1_1_twi_pap_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1500695084&sr=8-1&keywords=jen%20frahmstrong text

Leisha is an experienced change practitioner and the founder of Sticky Stories, a start up producing a library of workplace stories.

Contact Leisha at Sticky Stories for more or see some of the clips at the LinkedIn page

Related: Content Curation for Change

Hallmarks of a good conversation
Energy – when something new is emerging out of it.
When we are thrown together with different people and we get insights we can’t get alone

Where do you see the role of conversations in change (informal v formal)
We see repetition in the questions that keep coming up when we do things like roadshows. We need to look at the intention within the conversation.

What is the mix of instrumental and constructive intent in conversations
Conversations feel flat and hollow when they think they know the outcome of the conversation. When you see the spark in people’s eyes and we are off balance – there’s been an genuine unanswerable question, and this is what generates change.

How do you keep conversations open and flowing?
Dialogue events are usually strategic events with leadership teams, being offsite and in the wilderness. If the events are too cerebral it can go very flat. Use structures that mix it up and invite activity (like walks in pair to reflect on the themes).

How do we deal with silence in conversations?
Silence can be unnerving – but when we use silence in the walks it’s not seen as silence, it’s a pilgrimage. Things happen in the action of reflection (eg doodling, walking). Incorporate the silence in the conversation. People need silence to reflect and absorb in change – we need to incorporate space in the change programs for people to absorb the change.

Introverts and extroverts in dialogue experiments – any differences
Yes, the groups that are very introverted need a lot of time prior to the experiments to think about the topic. Even on the day, we need to put air into the program so they can

What makes somebody a good conversationalist?
That was the first hypothesis in our experiment – you need a good listener, challenger, provocateru, or the specialist who can get to the questions - people who are really curious and meaning makers. But after looking at those profiles, we’ve moved away to universal skills.

The qualities of a conversationalist

• Listening
• Being a good talker
• Challenger – shakes up a conversation in a good way
• Investigating and being curious
• Empathy and understand other people
• Making meaning
• Giving visibility to the harvesting of ideas

Stimulating Conversations – What’s the scoop?
A book that is being designed to create a space for conversation, instil more desire for intent of conversations, identify good questions for conversation, invitations for conversation, how you stay open to conversation.

A lot of online tools for design – eg divergent and convergent conversations, the GROW models, the Six Sigma processes.

Jeffer London website
Jeffer London Linkedin
Jeffer London twitter #stimulatingconversations
Stimulating Conversations
Jeffers TEDx talk Better conversations for a better world

A way of understanding the complex behaviour of complex systems - it's the dynamics of complex systems (social systems).

How to make the abstract element of systems dynamics concrete?

Practical applications of systems dynamics include: flows - changes in people, information and materials  eg the number of dollars that came in this month, the number of widgets in transit, the information that is coming in, how fast it arrives etc

Also interested in accumulation - difference between incoming flows and outgoing flows. Delays in systems are also of interest to us (examples provided in the financial departments provided on the frustration of non-real time reporting)

Feedback - one part of the system may produce some information that when another part of the system receives it they are compelled to respond

An example in practice in healthcare.

The typical flow is a patient arrives, nursing unit, to pre-op, into operating room, post op, then back to nursing unit.
The change challenge was to look at the throughput of the patient process to ensure beds could be available

Nexus of systems dynamics and organisational change?

When people say they have a problem, systems dynamics can help in establishing the problem. Equally - very successful businesses or departments within businesses don't often understand why they are successful. Systems dynamics helps with understanding why it is so.

How does System Dynamics deal with human behaviour

The ability to examine human behaviour - what's going on now, how would rate people's familiarity and acceptance and execution of a certain process. In SD we normalize the response - the present behaviour is 1.0 (example). A collapse of the system is 0 and improvement is more than 1. It's relatively easy to deal with soft human behaviour as you can then look at probability.

How did Bill get into this field

Teaching at Baltimore University - subscribed to the Systems Thinker and the articles intrigued Bill. Bought the software on a whim and to play with it. The pathway now is via computing courses, quantitative computer modelling.
Professor Jay Forrester - founder of the field, would say this is the only way.
BUT you get value in doing a causal loop diagram and qualitative inquiry.

Resources?

Business Dynamics, Prof John Sterman

What does a social anthropologist lens bring to organisational change work?

• Working with symbols
• People who are impacted by the change are best placed to design and implement the change
• Change should be iterative and collaborative

Example of how symbols are important

In the UN – how much carpet you had in your office denoted hierarchy. If you had a square of carpet it denoted you were very important and you would be listened to.

So to use in change – symbolism of senior leaders seen to be leading change and committed to the change has much greater impact than communicating the change.

Examples of people impacted by the change best to manage it?

Only people who are part of the culture can change it – external vendors cannot achieve this
There needs to be a partnership – organisations need to bring in change expertise, but they need to work with people in the organisation to make it work.
Social anthropologists believe that you cannot have the answer until we share information, design and plan together.

Examples of iterative
Organisations are never really standing still. What we do is plan based on what we know now, we implement and we see how the organisation reacts. There is not a focus on right or wrong, simply what is working and what needs to progress.

Trust is undermined by a focus on right or wrong.

How does a social anthropologist make sense of the change management profession?

I don’t use the language or term of change management.

Favourite question: Can you tell me what this change is about without using the words transformation, system or even the software? If we are talking about these we are talking about the solution, the new world, not the transition.

We can get lost in the jargon of change management

Tension between change management and organisational development?

It’s a divide between between people who see change management as people based v process based. To me it doesn’t make any sense to differentiate between them – if there’s a change, there’s a change. They still need support – whatever gets you through that is what is managing the change. Both perspectives provide value – traditionally OD people have not focused enough on the reality of business acumen. But change managers need to work deep in the business to make it stick and understand the time that it takes for change to actually occur.

How did Rita get into change work?

A lot of study!
Started with Andersen Consulting (Now Accenture)

What does a typical day look like?

No typical routine, large tolerance for change and ambiguity.
Client work, mid-career doctoral candidate – ABD (All But Dissertation), mother to 11 year old boy, yogi.

Motivation for the doctoral studies?

A client engagement (and their leaders) prompted Rita to complete the studies as a doctoral program. George Washington University provided a program that was flexible with family obligations and also the topic of culture and leadership in change. Rita’s dissertation focuses on organisational identity during M&As – how does the new culture emerges.

How does Rita manage the tension of academic v practitioner as a “pracademic”?

George Washington program is a scholar practitioner program.

The empirical research helps Rita lead with the practitioner focus and the work with clients. It provides rigour and confidence to customisation with clients.

It’s an art and a science – in order to be effective, you need to understand the human components. I wouldn’t be able to understand the nuances without the doctoral work.

Advice to those who want to do a doctoral degree?

You need to look at where you are in life, what purpose would it do for you?

Practical experience is necessary – you need to have been in the trenches, you can’t do it well straight out of undergrad.

It is a huge time commitment – it is a full time job, on top of the regular job to pay the bills, and you need to juggle with family and personal life.

You need to be maniacal with your time – in how it all fits in.

Supportive professors help too!

For the leaders of change – what’s the highlight of what they need to be thinking of?

If you are responsible for leading change you really need to understand stakeholder management. You need to have the right people on your team. Remove people who are not on the change mission with you.

Larger companies who have leadership programs that work on themselves (eg EQ) they are more adept at change leadership.

Context of the organisation, maturity of the business cycle and succession planning tend to have better leaders at managing change.

Future of Rita Meyerson post EdD

Be an adjunct business professor – influence the change curriculum
Policy change – family friendly work policies at government and industry level

Continue the conversation:

Twitter
Linkedin
Rita@RitaMeyerson.com

How did Luc get into change work?

What is Luc working on now?

Luc tells us about a change he is proud of

Luc shares of a change that didn't go so well

What are the most important things to heed about workplace change

• You are not working on an island
• We should be aware of the non formal structures in the community - tribal dynamics of change

Advice to those who are new in the industry - early career change managers

1. You need to master the basics first
2. Earn your entry ticket and then
   you build on that
3. Baby steps

What is Luc's favourite resources for learning more about change

Poetry!

Letters to a young poet by Rainer Maria Rilke

Helen's twitter account

Helen's website: Questo

Industrial / Organisational Psychology is the same name as workplace psychology / organisational psychology

siopchat on twitter is the chat referred to!

Where does big data sit in IO Psych and Org Change

Lot of talk about it, we need to get in front of it, potential for machine learning, and artificial intelligence in use in employee engagement.

Big debates in the space

• Annual performance reviews – continuous or once a year.

• IQ / EQ and personality types – how important are they?

• What’s the right combination of top down / bottom up engagement.

Latest issues in the space:

• Organisations need to bring in change managers early in the design, not after decisions are made

• Even if decisions are made, there are still opportunities to provide employees’s ownership so change is done with them, not to them.

• Are we trying to change the hearts and minds or just change behaviour.

Latest on the scene is behavioural economic and nudges, see “Nudge” by Thaler and Sunstein and “Thinking, fast and slow” by Kahneman

Pathway into I/O Psych – masters or PhD. PhDs are not necessarily academic.

Paul got into the field from counselling – still using psychology, but in a different way

Paul’s view on social media – ten years I didn’t have a social media presence, but volunteer roles in local OD group meant he had to get immersed in. He’s sees benefit with the curation of content and continue professional development.

Paul is speaking later on leveraging social media for learning at ATD-GTC

Further development?

Society for Industrial Organizational Psychology

SIOP.org

Social media – contact Paul on twitter.

The No-One Dies Alone program Bill volunteers with.

Skills that are transferrable post organisational change:

Deep listening
Good questions

Peter Block's attributes of powerful questions

• Personal
• Vague
• Anxiety provoking

In retrospect ...

My effectiveness would have been better as a change practitioner for deep listening and asking powerful questions.

The learning continues!

Theresa's Linkedin Profile

The Change Management Review

6.40 Judge and jury of the Change Management profession or facilitator of knowledge?

8.50 What does the background of change management consultant bring to entrepreneurial start ups?

11.45 Theresa's experience with ACMP

16.25 Advice to those starting out?

• Do some soul searching on what kind of impact do you want to have it in the world

• If it's change management, pay attention to soft skills that you need to do it well, and the tools and applications that you learn as you go along. You won't have impact if you don't have the soft skills.

MetaPM's website

Bronte's blog on life in Italy - she's a published author!

Advice to those wanting to get into change

Think about the reason why - if there is no emotional connection to people, don't bother

Bronte's top 3 tips on workplace change

1. t's not a silver bullet - never going to be quick and easy
2. Important to have a structured approach to change
3. Need to have resources for change - it's an investment, not a cost

Where does Bronte go to top up her knowledge on change?

Harvard Business Review
Linkedin for articles

10:17 Listen to Luc's challenge on the WIIFM of change

16:30 Listen to Luc make the connection between change management and chocolate making!

Luc's most recent post on Social Architecture

Luc's earlier Social Architecture Manifesto

Luc's website Reply MC

Luc's LinkedIn profile

Luc on twitter @lucgaloppin

Luc's book with Daryl Conner - Building commitment during an ERP roll out

Luc and Reen's Chocolate shop! Reen's Sweets and Treats

Luc's recommended reading:

Peter Block (2009) Community and the Structure of Belonging

The Abundant Community